Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo Auction Link (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Restoration & Repair Tips Board

Terminal block wiring on older 8n

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
elsinorerm

12-22-2004 14:24:30




Report to Moderator

Hi,
I'm working on replacing my crusty old wiring on my older (front dist mount) 8N. Just to make everything new, I was thinking about replacing the terminal block. All the wiring diagrams show two connections, and my original has three. Question 1. Does this actually go bad? Question 2. What's the difference between the two connection and three connection model if you are only dealing with "key on" "key off" circuits? Question 3. Should I just clean up the old one with a wire brush and forget about it? The replacement original is about $18.00, where as the two connection model is about $3.00 at the local auto parts store.

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
elsinorerm

12-23-2004 07:44:38




Report to Moderator
 Re: Terminal block wiring on older 8n in reply to elsinorerm, 12-22-2004 14:24:30  
Sorry guys that I did not mention that it was 12 volt. After examining the entire tractor more closely, it's hard to tell what I have. The person who had it before me, I would suspect, did the 12V conversion and appears to have followed a wiring diagram created by a first grader. Some of the wiring is not even close to the diagram but somehow it all works. This all started because the tractor wouldnt start, so silly me decided to try and make it right. Investigation has found that what I have does not match what appears to be "proper". Half the parts are old 6V stuff, half are 12V, wire appears to be old linked pieces from Thomas Edison's lab. Anyways, if some how I can get it into the lab (garage) I will attempt to go through it and make it all to spec. Wish me luck!
Rich
p.s. How much would it cost to have a pro come over and just do it? Free pizza and beer is about my limit.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
john in la

12-22-2004 21:04:27




Report to Moderator
 Re: Terminal block wiring on older 8n in reply to elsinorerm, 12-22-2004 14:24:30  
First off I may over step my spot here but from your post 2 spots down about starter relays I will think this tractor is 12 volts now. You need to mention this type of info when you ask elec. questions so we can give you proper info.
If I am wrong here I am sorry.

Now if you have a 8N with a front mount dist/coil it is a special animal. Originally it had a resistor built into the terminal block because the coil is really about a 3 or 4 volt coil. As Bob said it supplies 6V on start up but as it heats up it reduces voltage to the proper amount. If you were to take this resistor/terminal block out and replace it with a 2 terminal one with out the resistor it would burn up the points and coil.

But I think you have 12V's so you are even more special. If you are using the original 3 or 4 volt coil you will need a 12V to 6V resistor AND the original resistor wired in line to knock it down from 6V to 3 or 4V's.
They also now make a 12V coil for the front mount dist. I do not know if this coil needs a special resistor or not. Some 12V coils work on about 8V's and I am not sure about this one.

So if your terminal block is corroded and you still have the original coil you need to replace the terminal block with the original one with 3 terminals.

Maybe Bob can comment more on this now or you can go over to the 8N board and talk to a guy named Dell. He knows these front mount N's inside out.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bob

12-22-2004 22:33:04




Report to Moderator
 Re: Terminal block wiring on older 8n in reply to john in la, 12-22-2004 21:04:27  
Good point, John!

I missed his post below about 12 Volts.

The original front-mount 6 Volt coil, for use on 12 Volts, needs the original ballast resistor PLUS a 6 to 12 Volt CONVERTING RESISTOR. This is an automotive ballast resistor measuring about 1.6 Ohms.

If he is using an aftermarket "12 Volt" coil, he still needs to use Dell's "trick current limiting resistor ahead of the coil, but DO NOT use the original ballast resistor with this setup.

The "trick current limiting resistor" consists of 2 - 1 Ohm 10 Watt resistors connected in PARALLEL to make a .5 Watt, 20 Ohm resistor.

This "trick" resistor prolongs breaker point and coil life, and is needed because it seems the aftermarket coil manufacturers spec'd the coil out to work at about 13 Volts, rather than thee 14 to 14.75 Volts a 12 Volt alternator system actually operates at.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bob

12-22-2004 19:45:44




Report to Moderator
 Re: Terminal block wiring on older 8n in reply to elsinorerm, 12-22-2004 14:24:30  
The diagram you need is the second one shown one the page linked below.

The third terminal is simply an insulated junction point.

The original resistor, or a CORRECT replacement is a POSITIVE TEMPERATURE COEFFICIENT resistor.

When the ignition is first turned on, the resistor has a low resistance, for better spark while starting (the load of the starter draw on the battery pulls the battery voltage down, weakening the spark).

Within a minute or two, the resistor heats up from current flowing through it, and it's resistance increases, dropping the voltage to the coil, for longer point and coil life.

A generic ballast resistor from an auto parts store MAY OR MAY NOT be temperature compensated.

The non-temperature compensated resistors are generally a higher resistance, and are used on systems that have a switch in the starter solenoid to apply full battery voltage to the coil while the starter is cranking, and are generally for 12 Volt systems. If you are still 6 Volt, the OEM resistor is your best bet.

If you can clean the connections on the old resistor, and the coiled resistance wire is not damaged or broken, MOST LIKELY, it'll work OK.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy