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Extreme size welding

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 01:34:14

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Since there seems to be a lot of interest in welding, I looked for some pictures of some of the bigger projects that are built here. I didn't realize the first fabricator was the biggest in North America. A friend of mine who's in the union has done a lot of work there. He said they are so good that they can cut the holes in the vessel for flanges etc. before they roll the shell. The other shop is older but is a competitor of the first one. Both shops are usually very busy. Another shop here forms a lot of components for vessels up to 8 inches thick! They have the largest head press in North America. I went to school with the foreman. Check out these sites: Dacro Industries and Cessco. Click on the small pics to enlarge them. These things can't have flaws. Enjoy. Dave

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Bud in NC

10-31-2006 04:01:38

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

I was missing in action yesterday so I'm getting here late. Glad I don't have to work on the big stuff now - I'm too old and crippled! On a slight side trip but still dealing with big stuff, about 15 years ago I was sent down to Elliott Company in Jacksonville, Fl to witness some maching on some turbine parts. That usually means you have a *bunch* of time to sit and wait to take a mic reading so like any normal construction type, I did some exploring at the place. They have a vertical lathe with a table that's 40+ feet wide but the thing they had that really impressed me was an engine lathe - the levers to change feed speed were about 12 feet in the air, the bed ways were almost 100 feet long and I remember being told that it had a 177" swing - that's 14 ft 9 in! There was an operators chair mounted to the tool post saddle. Inside one of the doors was the old old swastika and German eagle. They said the lathe had been used during WW2 to produce cannon barrels. They also did spin balancing on turbine rotors there. Trust me - a 144 ton LP rotor spinning 1800 RPM will VENTILATE a large shop!!!! Naw - I made it point not to get near that operation!

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Hank ABAB

10-30-2006 18:30:03

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

Check the ASME Code to see the maximum size flaws allowed. Your statement is not entirely correct.

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 18:53:10

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to Hank ABAB, 10-30-2006 18:30:03

All the shops I've worked at up here fix any flaw. Most customers want the code exceeded. They keep X-rays for 7 years in case of a future problem. It also depends on which code. There are hundreds of different codes. We have a lot of extremely picky inspectors and so do the customers spending the big bucks. Nuclear spec. pretty much means flawless, no repairs. Very critical work has to have an exact procedure qualification observed. Dave

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Billy NY

10-30-2006 17:43:54

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

This post reminded me of the shop next to the lumber yard where I used to work 20 years ago, both still in business, I always thought it was an amazing shop, have seen some large vessels come out of there. I remember when the old man Ed,(pictured in the site) was still there, everyday, in his dark blue work clothes, must have been in his 80's then. Nice people, whenever my flatbed dump body needed work, one of their guys would always do the welding right away. Most business's like these left this once great industrial city, glad they survived.

Those 16" guns, shown on the USS Iowa were manufactured nearby, at the Watervliet Arsenal, I'm not sure if they were fabricated completely at this location, from raw material or not, but can tell you the finished product most certainly rolled off the production line here. I found an old railroad photo of one of these on it's way to the arsenal, might have been smaller, was way before WWII but it was headed to the shop for machining I believe, lots of people gathered at the bridge to watch the train haul it across. I used to deliver to the arsenal, it's an amazing facility, lucky it has not been closed, a neighbor by the farm works there, used to be a busy place, been there since the early 1800's, some manufacturing capabilities:

Link

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T_Bone

10-30-2006 15:07:50

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

Hi Dave,

Always glad to see another weldor join the fourms :)

I got too see the worlds largest crawler crane, 3500tons, loaded on a barge ready to be shipped overseas. Too bad but they would not let anyone close enough for a good look. I would bet that crane is no longer the worlds largest crane.

The most interesting weldment I got involved in was welding 1/2" CU brew kettles at Coors. They were about 12ft in diameter and 16ft tall with polished CU domes as this was part of the visitor plant tours. One very hot job Tig welding at 360amps inside the kettles with a 1100� preheat. I had "green" colored skin for several months from working the CU.

Another good Tig welding job was 5ft butterfly air valves where the weldment was 100% Tig from the root too the cover pass.

Another tank job was the SS ferminting tanks that was 14ft high, 44ft long, and 22ft wide. It's been to many years ago so my deminsions could be off. Again at Coors.

Another tank job was curing tanks that were 20ft diameter x 44ft long, 3/4" thick Fe, glass lined, that were submurge arc welded that I also got to run for awhile. The tanks were all 44 ft long as too fit in the building, one on each side of a center isle on a 100ft wide building.

It's amazing to see some of the componets we build today but just think back 75yrs ago of what they built with less tools than we have today. Just look at the componets of a steam engine tractor. What a challenage it must have been to make those parts and as accurate as they were made. Just amazing!

Tom-in-WI (thank you Tom) just sent me a couple Lincoln welding texts, one being 1939 and one 1940, where welding with bare electrodes was the sign of a top notch weldor. I just barely got into the subject, but dang, that's amazing in it's self.

T_Bone

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 16:31:45

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to T_Bone, 10-30-2006 15:07:50

I didn't do pressure work too much. I was at a place for work experience for school and went with one of the welders to repair an oilfield vessel. It was steamed for two weeks and I couldn't stay in for longer than about 10 min. The welder could stay in twice as long and he was wearing a leather jacket. It was about 90 deg. outside and felt real nice coming out. He said that was nothing. He had welded inside vessels that were so hot that he had to wear an asbestos suit!
Probably the biggest vessel I worked on was about 60tons. About 12 ft. diameter 30 or 40 ft. long and 2 3/4inches thick. I did the MIG root and hot pass before sub-arc for one of the heads. It is an interesting story. I was on night shift and the day shift had tacked the head on with pieces of round bar put in the groove and welded on both sides to preserve the root opening. Early in the shift I was getting a MIG machine set up to do the root pass as well as a tiger torch to keep it warm. I was talking to a another welder when we started hearing these pinging sounds. They got faster and faster and all of a sudden boom! The head fell off, partially crushed a wire feeder sitting on a cart with a Miller XMT 304 inverter welding machine on the bottom. Luckily no one got hurt but there was a dent in the thick concrete floor. Sometimes there is a lot of pressing to get a good fit up and it puts a lot of stress on the tacks. I remember this job also because my friend, who later worked at Dacro, and I were welding in a 22 inch nozzle on the vessel. It was "v'd" out in order to get 100% penetration. Later it would be back gouged from the inside and filled in. The weld on top had to be slighly over flush and ground flat because a 2 1/2 inch thick repad had to go over. Thats a lot of welding. We wouldn't grab rods from the oven, we just brought a new box of 1/4 inch 7018A1 over. The job used an especially large amount of filler rod because someone made the repad for a 24 inch pipe instead of a 22 inch. It was v'd all the way around and was in two pieces that were also v'd out. It took 2 1/2 shifts with two welders burning 1/4 rods to finish! It was easier than having to roll and make a new repad.
I have a book with the giant excavators in it. They are impressive! Syncrude had some bucket wheels that were built on site. It took three mobile homes to lay out all the blue prints! A lot of people don't realize the magnitude of some of these big projects that are welded. Even more impressive is the old excavators that were rivetted. Wasn't the original topic about welding sheet metal? LOL Dave

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XRogerX

10-30-2006 14:44:47

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

Yep, I've been through both of those shops working on compressors. People have no idea the amount of work that comes out of Edmonton, and I've been through most of the shops there. The most impressive one, I think, was Dreco Industries (not Dacro) on 75th street. I was there one day when they were finishing off a huge drilling rig. The rig had retractable wheels undreneath it. It could actually drive itself across the tundra (and I don't mean one of those truck mounted service rigs, this was the size of an apartment building). The tires were $30k apiece and about 8 ft tall. Alberta is really gone into overdrive with oil prices being where they are. I could kick myself for leaving, as there is virtually nowhere to rent in the entire province anymore. My brother works at a hot-oiler company in Red Deer. They were going to fly him home to Newfoundland to try and recruit some welders to work for them, including finding them apartments and paying their way out.

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 15:39:19

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to XRogerX, 10-30-2006 14:44:47

Dreco is part of National oilwell, I think. They still have a shop on 75th street but most of the real big stuff is built in Nisku. I worked at Alco gas and oil and they built big compressor packages for natural gas that used 12 and 16 cylinder Cat natural gas engines. Also worked at Wells-Hall [serval] but they closed the shop here. We have some pretty high tech shops up here for sure. Dave

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XRogerX

10-30-2006 17:06:43

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 15:39:19

I was through Wells-Hall as well. Still remember opening up that little trap door to get to the compressor radiator and blowing the crap out of it. Always left there looking like a pipe cleaner. The air in that shop was the bluest of any I'd been through. Pretty low grade!

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paul

10-30-2006 10:47:44

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

> These things can't have flaws.

Only flaw is, I see no picture, I see no link, I see no address, and so have no idea what I should enjoy or what you are talking about. ;)

Watch them build ships on Discovery Channel, etc. every now & them, pretty interesting stuff.

--->Paul

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 10:56:38

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to paul, 10-30-2006 10:47:44

Google "Dacro Industries" and "Cessco". I said this in my post. I'm not a computer wizz by any means and don't know how to put a link on. I'm just a welder, but I still have my eye sight. Maybe yours should be checked? Not meaning to sound grouchy. I'm not old enough yet. Interesting pictures though. Dave

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paul

10-30-2006 18:22:09

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 10:56:38

Yup, I noticed the co name; however you talked about some pictures, & 'just click on the pictures' which lead me to believe something was missing from my screen.

Simple misunderstanding.

--->Paul

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 18:37:53

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to paul, 10-30-2006 18:22:09

Everythings good. I meant to say click on the small pictures after you get to the site. I feel like crawling in a vessel. It would be a lot easier than figuring out these darn computers. The welders and boilermakers making these things get pretty good money but it's all relative. Welding used to be one of the higher paying jobs. It still can be but there are people sitting behind a desk twiddling their fingers that are making over 100K a year. The highly skilled and talented trades people that have to do precision work are making less than some pencil pushing geek. I think it is an injustice. These things could kill a lot of people if they failed. Can't say that about someone spelling a word wrong in some bogus report to justify their job. Dave

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paul

10-30-2006 20:47:04

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 18:37:53

That's ok - I got my dad's welding skills. I can make 2 sticks of iron hold together to finish harvest, but it don't look good & it don't hold too much. Always admired folks that can make iron do something.

Wood I can work with, & I suppose some would call me a computer geek since about 1979..... Great hobby, used to sell the things when 64k of memory was a huge step up from 16k.

Ah, but farming - working with dirt. _That's_ fun. :)

--->Paul

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mjbrown

10-30-2006 05:22:52

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 01:34:14

I met a distant relative at a picnic a few years ago who is a retired welder. He used to weld steam pipes during nuclear power plant construction. These pipes had 5" thick walls. They used preheater collars on either side of the joint and the first pass was tig welded, then they went to work with sticks. I think he said it took a couple of days to weld a joint. Needless to say, no inclusions allowed.

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IMKCMAC

10-30-2006 10:59:26

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to mjbrown, 10-30-2006 05:22:52

Those are some incredibly huge welding projects.
Here are the links.I bet the employees make good money for that kind of work.

Link

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 11:17:31

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to IMKCMAC, 10-30-2006 10:59:26

Thanks IMKCMAC! It is greatly appreciated. Dave

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IMKCMAC

10-30-2006 11:15:37

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to IMKCMAC, 10-30-2006 10:59:26

Here's the other.

Link

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IMKCMAC

10-30-2006 11:13:02

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to IMKCMAC, 10-30-2006 10:59:26

Try this again.Here's one.

Link

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135 Fan

10-30-2006 10:37:57

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to mjbrown, 10-30-2006 05:22:52

My friend did a lot of the piping work on the 400 ton cokers [in picture] for Suncor at Dacro. 4 inch double extra heavy pipe welded with an automatic orbital TIG welder. It had to be to nuclear specs!, meaning that if it had a flaw in the X-ray, the complete joint had to be cut out and redone! Most times the weld can be repaired without having to cut the whole joint out. All of this big stuff is pre heated before and during welding and stress releived after welding so there are are absolutely no stress points that could fail. Most vessels have extra thickness built in to allow for some corrosion. The trucking to move these big vessels is astronomical but still not even close to millions some of these vessels cost. Special saddles are made to hold and carry the vessels on the trailers. I think there only used once and there not cheap either. Imagine if there wasn't welding? It is one of the most important technologies needed for daily living. Thought some people might be interested in seeing some big weldments. Dave

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TomH in PA

10-30-2006 16:21:50

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Re: Extreme size welding in reply to 135 Fan, 10-30-2006 10:37:57

Impressive work. I've always been fascinated by what went into the making of one of these. Imagine the energy a 16" gun has, then multiple that by 9:
third party image

USS Missouri

third party image USS Iowa

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