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stihl chainsaw

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kez

09-10-2007 15:15:00

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I bought a D17 30cm stihl in 1997. I don't think I used it very much. I bought two new chains for it. The last chain is still quite good.It now has vertical scratches on the cylinder walls. New parts nearly equal the cost of a new saw. I am thinking of buying a new saw of about the 30cm size but not another stihl. I talked to a Johnsered dealer and he told that he had 3 models of Johnserd that he no longer would sell as they had problems. I asked if the 30cm had problems and he told me NO. Another brand that I'm not familar with is an Echo- 5 yr warranty.There is a service dealer near me. Suggestions and comments would be appreciated.

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Bob - MI

09-11-2007 06:46:49

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

Chain saws are getting to be a hot topic I see. Check out the chatter on page 2 from last week concerning the best suggestion for a 16" chain saw.

I am coming to the conclusion that there is no single best unit based on the loyal following that each brand seems to have.

I am an occasional user and I have 2 saws that would be considered junk by most. I am lucky I guess that I haven't had any trouble.

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09-11-2007 14:58:48

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to Bob - MI, 09-11-2007 06:46:49

I am not loyal to any kind of saw, I talk from 30 years of experience working on them. I do not use saws unless I have to, too much work for this old fat man.
Most people will have good luck with all saws, depends on if they understand and do maintenance. I am not a Stihl dealer, I sell Poulan, Dolmar, and Poulan Pro saws, and I still work on more Stihl products than any other except for the MTD/Troybilt saws, no there is a peice of work for you all to chew about, pure cheaply built. Echo makes a good saw, Dolmar still does, and are still a German saw, Husquvarna makes some good ones, and some cheap ones, Jonsred makes a few good ones, some are nto so good, Stihl did make good saws, but now, Stihl will make up a hundred excuses to keep from paying warranty on their cheap made saws. Shindaiwa makes a real nice saw, hard to find a dealer, Tanaka makes a fair saw, again, finding a dealer for service is a problem. I could go on all day, your best bet is to not go to a box store, find a dealer that you can feel you can trust, and buy his saw, Ask him what gas the manufacturer recommends, buy his 2 cycle oil, mix it right, use pure gas, not the cheapest alchohal fuel you can find, and no matter what saw you get, it should be a good one. Enough said, I will start another war on saws!

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jdemaris

09-12-2007 06:35:37

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to JT, 09-11-2007 14:58:48

I've been working on saws since the 1960s for several dealers - back when Homelite was not just a "consumer level" saw. I worked for the first Stihl dealer in the country - and we got an awful lock of flack at that time - about selling foreign saws with poor parts support. We also had a lot or resistance to automatic chain oiling. We also sold a few "oddballs" like Sachs-Dolmar, Solo, Hoe, etc. I'm trying to find a few parts now for a Hoe. I think you'd have to be nuts to have any brand-loyality - since all the companies make some cheap versions. From what I've seen - it all, basically comes to this. If a saw has ball-bearings for mains - NOT sleeve or needle-bearings - and a good cylinder wall - and piston-porting for fuel induction - it can be made to last a long time - regardless of make. Companies have made cylinders with soft metal, some with a thin, poorly-bonded chrome plated, some with cast-iron liners, and others with a silicon-impregnated wall that is pretty durable.
That makes a huge differnce. When we first started selling Stihl - late 60s as I recall - their claim to fame was the Mahl-process used to make the cylinder-walls. Their pistons - even then - were made in Japan - not West Germany. Whatever the process is - it worked. We had Homelites - the newer red XL12s falling apart with soft cylinders, Poulans with thin chrome-plating peeling off, etc. Then, the newer Homelites wearing out crankshafts at the needle-bearing mains. So, the Sthils - in that regard - were a pleasure. But, then Stihl started selling cheap stuff too. Problem is - it's not always easy to know what you're getting. Try asking a dealer what's inside the saw he/she's selling. Yeah some DO know, but many don't have a clue. I just bought two new Sear's 55 cc saws. They have an extremely awful spring-loaded pull-start system - and they are made in Malyasia. But - Sears had full parts breakdowns right at the store, and the saws seem to be incredibly well built. Hard cylinder wall liner and full ball-bearing support. They had a close-out sale and were selling these saws - with 20" bars and two chains - for $149. Pretty good deal as far as I can tell. We'll see how long they last.

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jdemaris

09-11-2007 06:45:24

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

I don't know what happened to your saw - but cylinders can get damaged by all the things other posters have already mentioned. And, they can also self-destruct all on their own - regardless of what kind of maintenance you do or what kind of fuel mix you use. Back in the 60s, Homelite was having all kinds of problems with cylinder wall scoring, plating peeling, etc. That's when Stihl started getting popular because their hardened cylinder walls were better than anything being made in the US at that time. I'm still using my Stihl 040, 030, and S10 saws that were new in the mid-1960s. But . . . Stihl decided to enter the el-cheapo home user market - maybe late 70s? I was a Stihl mechanic - but can't recall all the dates. When the 015 came it - it wasn't too bad. But later, with crap like the 011, etc.? Cheap cylinder-walls as well as other parts. I've got Sthils up to the point when they changed over to plastic from magnesium - e.g. 045 Supers, 075 Lightning, etc. Personally, for a big saw I don't want plastic. My point is - some of the name brands on their own don't mean much anymore. That because they all want a piece of the home user market. Subsequently, they all have some versions that are absolute crap - and that includes Sthil, Husky, etc. I suggest, no matter what you buy - use a heavier oil-to-fuel mix than recommended. And make sure the saw has ball bearings for main bearings - and NOT needle-bearings. The lean mixes are advised only to meed EPA regs - NOT to make your saw last. I've used a 20 to 1 mix for years - and it works very well. That, not including my 1950s gear-drive Homelites that call for 16 to 1. I've had no exhaust port or plug fouling and haven't worn anything out other than chains and sprockets. In regard to Echo - they have always made very good engines and saws. It is actually Kiortiz Corportion of Japan. We sold their stuff back in the mid 1970s when they first came to the U.S. with backpack leaf blowers. Deere Company later dropped their crap Remmington saws - and made the Echo the Deere saw instead. One funny note - about Poulan. Years ago - I used to curse them. We had many come into our shop with chrome literally peeling off their cylinder walls. What crap! But, a few years back - I spotted - at a yard sale - a "Sears Best" 55 cc. chainsaw with a 20" chain. It was almost new - and I reluctantly paid $50 for it - figuring it was junk - but I'd keep it for a beater. I found out later it's a pro-version, 3.3 cubic inch Poulan. It's been a fantastic saw - and since, after searching - I've bought three more - used and cheap. Very durable, full ball bearing mains, etc. Never thought I'd be caught saying this - but these particular Poulans are pretty good saws.

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kez

09-11-2007 10:32:19

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to jdemaris, 09-11-2007 06:45:24

In my Lawnboy I use additional oil. I agree its helps with lonegevity, it dosen't need peak power as its not a race car. I have a back problem so use a small saw. My stihl (30 cm)seemed so small when I bought it that I followed the oil/fuel mix very carefully so as not to kill any power. I also was using hi-test gas. I've just been reading the Stihl manual and it says that shouldn't be a problem. The problem would be if the octane no. of regular grade was to low it could cause "pinging" and risk of piston seizure. I plan to add extra oil on my next chainsaw.

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TomTex

09-11-2007 05:35:45

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

Get the Echo, and don't look back. Tom

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patsublett

09-10-2007 20:11:46

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

I agree. If the cylinder is scratched, it's not the saw's fault. I owned a Husqvarna dealership and authorized repair center for several years. I have worked on all kind of saws. Stihl is a very good saw. Husqvarna is a good saw, some of the cheap ones are nothing but orange Poulans, The ones with numbers begining with 1, 136, 141,etc.Good ones are made in Sweden 200 & 300 series. Dolmar is a good saw. All of the wood cutters around here swear by Stihl. Even # model saws are made in Germany (the best) cheaper ones made in VAginia Beach Va.

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RossIL

09-11-2007 11:10:47

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to patsublett, 09-10-2007 20:11:46

Has that always been true? I've got a 1977 041 and my Dad has 031 from 1979 ish that have been great saws.
Ross

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Shovelman

09-10-2007 18:20:49

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

Vertical scratches in the P&C are usually caused by:

1) Improper oil/fuel mixture ratio.

2) Carb settings too lean.

3) Gasoline/alcohol separation in supply can or fuel tank.

4) Overheat due to plugged cooling fins or cooling air intake screen(s).

5) Ingestion of dirt/silica - either through defective or improperly serviced air cleaner or muffler. The latter happens when the saw is left in the back of a pickup and driven around, where sand or dirt gets blown into the saw.

Just about any saw can be ruined by any of these situations, regardless of brand.

Buy your next saw from a local servicing dealer who will take care of you after the sale. Saws require routine maintenance, either by the owner or the dealer.

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Jim in Ma.

09-10-2007 17:48:55

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

I have a small echo I only use it trimming when up in the bucket truck, 6 years old and still a very good saw. on the ground I use a stihl "028" about the same age, it's also a good saw.

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jd b puller

09-10-2007 17:42:20

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

Kez, why are there vertical scratches? Wrong fuel/oil, too lean, etc.

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kez

09-11-2007 03:38:38

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to jd b puller, 09-10-2007 17:42:20

After reading the post by Shovelman I've wondered about two things. I always burnt the correct oil/fuel mix. I used the specal Stihl oil. However I used hi-test gas as fuel. Maybe this might have caused the problem. Also I could have kept the air cooling vents cleaner.

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jd b puller

09-11-2007 19:14:39

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-11-2007 03:38:38

Kez, the fact that you used High Test shouldn't hurt anything. The age and condition of it are a lot more important. Have you taken it apart, I'd like to see pictures of where the scoring is? Just on the exhaust side or on the intake, or all the way around? Is it scored or seized?

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kez

09-12-2007 15:54:24

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to jd b puller, 09-11-2007 19:14:39

Hi, sorry but I,m not equipped for pictures. I haven't taken it apart. Its not seized. With the muffler off you can see scoring here and there all the way around.

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jd b puller

09-12-2007 18:34:45

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-12-2007 15:54:24

Scoring on the exhaust side only generally indicates a lean seizure. If you've got scoring all the way around, it's likely from detonation or straight gas. Yes, too much oil will lower the octane rating... Aged fuel loses octane too. You when you look at the top of the piston, you might be able to see dual flame fronts, further indicating the detonation.

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Jerry Eime

09-10-2007 17:28:26

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

Go with a Dolmar, Redmax or Husqvara. Echo is a good saw as well but I really dont know about that saw that much. But I am a dealer for the three above and we have had great luck with all three. Hardley and parts sold and only a few warrenty claims. These are great saws and you would have many years out of them. By far though, the Dolmar is the best saw that I have ever ran. They are German made. And another note, parts for these saws dont cost as much as a whole saw. That is what you get when you get a still. "Still Not Running" Good luck.

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Jerry Eime

09-13-2007 06:03:21

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to Jerry Eime, 09-10-2007 17:28:26

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Ted in NE OH

09-10-2007 15:44:28

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Re: stihl chainsaw in reply to kez, 09-10-2007 15:15:00

I has bad luck with a Johnserd. Started running bad . Took to dealer he said I ran it with out oil in gas which was not true. Sent off to factory 6 mos later factory said no warranty. Dealer is now out of business, that will teach him.

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