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Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel

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SDE

10-27-2007 06:40:44




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Last Oct. I put the Solar Panels up to get them out of the way. This year I want to get them working. The original duct work was flexible, insulated, round 6" for heat and 8" for the cold air return. I have to replace all of the ducts, because they were ruined when removed from my Dad's house. I want to hide both runs by running them down thru two different first floor closets and into the basement. The heat run would stop at the basement ceiling.
The cold air return would extend to the floor and pull air from the same room, but be about 15ft away. Is is O.K. or should it go to a different room?
Does the cold air return need to be insulated in the closets also? If would probably be easier to install a rigid retangular vent from the basement floor to the attic. I can understand insulating it in the attic.
I am not familiar with what types of ducts that may be available. What size retangluar vent would be compatiable with the 6" and the 8"round?
All help is greatly appreciated
SDE

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T_Bone

10-29-2007 13:11:43




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to SDE, 10-27-2007 06:40:44  
Hi SDE,

Well it seams you solar collector was installed wrong to began with. When air is heated it expands so the supply air should be the 8" duct.

As to duct sizing? Sorry no help here as there's just too many design considerations, like grains of moisture per pound of air, fan CFM at what static presssure, and the big one, hot air will rise and cold air sinks.

Since your collector is located higher than your treated rooms, this creates considerable engineering thoughts for correct design, as in many books on the subject.

Sorry but I just don't have the time to engineer such system.

The best idea would be to do some serious reading then make your best trial and error install. It will work but at somewhat less efficency than a well designed engineered system.

T_Bone

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circus

10-27-2007 17:03:37




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to SDE, 10-27-2007 06:40:44  
Don't know about your specific design but seems the insulation is not to save solar heat but for really cold nights. Is there some sort of check to stop reverse cooling at night?



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SDE

10-27-2007 19:18:42




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to circus, 10-27-2007 17:03:37  
I assumed that the insulation on the cold air return is to keep the air from getting colder before it gets to the solar panel.
There is a thermal switch wired in to the power to the blower motor so that when the temperature drops, it will shut down.
I usually focus on one project at a time. This one was easy to put off because I did not want to go into the attic until ...well never actually.
Thank you
SDE

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circus

10-28-2007 09:42:43




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to SDE, 10-27-2007 19:18:42  
My 8'x 8' solar air heater is mounted directly on the south wall. No blower, no ducting and no wiring. Just upper and lower holes in the wall with plastic bag flaps to prevent reverse convection at night. With no blower the holes are pretty big, almost 50% of the horizontal cross section of the collector. Works great but without a ceiling fan the floor would be 50 and the ceiling would be 100. Haven't figured out how to store the heat yet. Until then I can't tell British petroleum to go ^**% themselves. I'm no pro but with a blower almost any layout would work. The inlet and outlet should be in the same room. Why your ducts are insulated in a heated closet is a mystery. At night, cold air would reverse right through a fan.

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circus

10-30-2007 08:11:18




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 this should help in reply to circus, 10-28-2007 09:42:43  
Link



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Stan in Oly, WA

10-27-2007 10:02:24




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to SDE, 10-27-2007 06:40:44  
Hi SDE,

3 X 10 is a convenient size because it can be completely contained in a 16" OC 2x4 stud channel, which I believe is still the most common framing for interior house walls. If the walls aren't open, or the installation doesn't allow for opening them, 3 X 10 still protrudes into the room only 1/2 as much as 6" round. By volume 3 X 10 provides about 6% more air than 6" round, but only 60% of what 8" round provides.

T_Bone is the person who can answer the question about the need for insulation.

Stretching your project over several years sounds depressingly familiar. I've come to the conclusion that the reason I do it is because, as an existentialist, it gives me something to live for. That sounds better than "lack of focus" doesn't it? Maybe not.

All the best, Stan

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Sid

10-27-2007 12:05:33




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to Stan in Oly, WA, 10-27-2007 10:02:24  
I got lots of focus. Just don't have any round tuits to work with. I read your reply, to me about Tumwater. Next question. Isn't there a little place called Roy close to Lacy



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Stan in Oly, WA

10-27-2007 17:35:14




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 Re: Heat and cold air return for Solar Panel in reply to Sid, 10-27-2007 12:05:33  
Hi Sid,

I may know of a place in your area where you can get a round tuit---but you'll have to hurry. You can't wait if you ever want to get a round tuit. That's not an oxymoron, so it must be a conundrum.

Roy is indeed east of Lacey, but the southern half of the Fort Lewis Military Reservation is between them. Here in west Olympia we hear a lot of what sounds like thunder from Fort Lewis. In Roy it must shake the dishes out of the kitchen cupboards, but I suppose that people in Roy view it as a fair price to pay for the privilege of living in the middle of nowhere.

Fort Lewis always posts a phone number in the Olympia newspaper for people to call to complain about the artillery noise. I think it's a nice gesture. You call, you complain, nothing changes---your government inaction.

All the best, Stan

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