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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder

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Tim B from MA

02-14-2008 13:33:47




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The Miller Mig power source I mention in my post below is a 70s vintage Model SCP 200C snJA366337.

I need to replace the main fuse to the control panel.

It is a 6A, 600V rated BUSS fuse - the issue is the fuse body (i.e., physical size of the fuse) is 5.5 inches long and nearly 3/4 inch OD.

For life of me, I can't understand why the used / needed such a large fuse body for a 6A fuse ??

I checked with electric supply house - they don't have anything like that.

A replacement will take a week to get (based on my experience with weld shops, that will probably be more like 3 to 4 weeks) and cost $16.
For all know, it could blow again right off the bat.

Anyone see any electrical reason why I can't stop at Radio Shack, buy a BUSS fuse mount for a "normal" size 6A BUSS fuse and replace the mount that is there? I have not priced it, but I am assuming most BUSS fuses that size cost a couple bucks, and the fuse mount will be less than $16, and if it goes again, I can replace it cheaply and quickly.

Thanks,

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Slowpoke

02-24-2008 22:18:21




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Grainger has a 600v, 6amp, 5x 13/16, class K-5, Bussman #NOS-6. 4XH03, $8.56. If your old fuse has a K-5 listing, this could be the replacement.



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Tim B from MA

02-15-2008 06:38:50




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 Update, additional info in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Thanks to all for convincing me is it important to do a bit more work to get the right equipment.

I found new-old-stock (sort of) replacements on the internet and bought 4 for the price of one new one from my welding supply store (I'd bet I get them sooner too).

This fuse has a paper cartridge so fire prevention or physical saftey does not seem to be an issue.

I also found info sheets on these fuses (Bussman NOS) on the Cooper-Bussman web site. Based on my read, there really does not seem to be anything special about this fuse, except it's physical size. Perhaps that is just to prevent arching across the fuse block when it blows ???

Anyhow, thanks again.
Tim

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Bob

02-15-2008 06:58:59




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 Re: Update, additional info in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-15-2008 06:38:50  
Even if the outside is paper, you will find it packed full of a fire/arc retardant powder. (I USED to know what they used!)

ANYHOW, it's the LENGTH that helps to keep a destructive arc from occuring when the fuse blows.

Some more modern 600 V. fues are shorter, I'd 'spect they have a more "high tech" arc suppression material in them to compensate.



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Tim B from MA

02-17-2008 18:58:09




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 Re: Update, additional info in reply to Bob, 02-15-2008 06:58:59  
Yes Bob I opened up the old one, and saw the powder.

The element was broken but to me it looked like it corroded (some oxidation evident on the copper element) rather than melted (Of course I can't tell for sure), so I'm hoping it did not blow.

Of course I if that is the case, I would also wonder what else has corroded in the machine.



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36 coupe

02-17-2008 14:57:56




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 Re: Update, additional info in reply to Bob, 02-15-2008 06:58:59  
These 5 inch fuses are not uncommon ,I found a box of 30 amp Royal NO ARK on the shelf.Theres a 3 fuse block with some 3 and 2/10 amp dual element fuses in it.I expect they were used in 440 v circuits.



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Tim B from MA

02-15-2008 06:50:45




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 sorry -one more thing in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-15-2008 06:38:50  
I'm not sure the fuse is actually blown - it may be physically damaged/worn out. The copper/brass contacts are loose on the carboard cartridge and when you twist them one way you get some continuity and the other you get an none. After I get my replacements, I'll cut it open and have a look.

This welder seems to have sat in a humid basement for a long time so the cardboard cartridge may have been comprimised by moisture.

I took a chance on the machine for $100.

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36 coupe

02-15-2008 02:11:12




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
You may have a problem in the control panel.Miller put that type of fuse in there for a good reason.Ive seen this type of fuse in radio equipment.It looks like the fuse body is made of fiberglass to avoid fire problems.Microwave ovens use ceramic body fuses to avoid flying glass when a fuse blows.A fuse will blow for no apparent reason once in a while but there is usually a cause.Better have the welder checked by someone who knows what they are doing.When a fence charger comes in with blown fuses I look for the cause before I put new fuses in the holders.

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Tim B from MA

02-14-2008 19:39:36




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Looks like the Bussman fuse type is "NOS".



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IH2444

02-14-2008 17:16:43




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Hmm you might want to get a couple of replacement fuses if you do not know why it blew.



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munos dinero

02-14-2008 15:41:24




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Yes it's in there for a reason like that or they would have put in a small mickey mouse one to begin with. It blowing out may have saved your life already and you didn't know it. Tell any supplier if want to pay the extra freight and they can probably get it much sooner. Check other electrical supplies or industrial supply places too.

Link



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Bob

02-14-2008 13:54:08




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Tim B from MA, 02-14-2008 13:33:47  
Likely, the fuse is made like that to contain the high voltage arc that can occur when the current to the large INDUCTOR (transformer) inside the welder is interrupted by the fuse blowing.

There is a REASON for it's "600 Volt" rating and it's construction, and you need to respect that, to keep the machine safe.

I'm sure you could get a replacement from Grainger or McMaster in between one and three days. Do it RIGHT, and keep it safe!

(What is the part # on the old fuse?)

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Tim B from MA

02-14-2008 19:17:04




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 Re: Replace Buss Fuss set-up in a welder in reply to Bob, 02-14-2008 13:54:08  
On the surface I often think I know it all, but deep down I know I don't. Thankfully I have the great folks on this forum to set me straight!

The fuse is a Bussman brand, No. on the fuse is D604-66.

Part number in the Miller manual is 012 639.

Thanks,
Tim



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