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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Concrete

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tlak

07-23-2004 06:03:06




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I guess somebody needs to educate me. I've seen a couple different stories on a shortage of concrete because of it going to China. I thought concrete was a mix of all natural mined parts or is there some base that concrete people have to buy?




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Bob

07-24-2004 20:42:22




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
Yes there is a concrete shortage. It has to do with both oil and demand. Check this link Link there was also some info in the Wall Street Journal a few weeks ago (subscription required).



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Matt Clark

07-23-2004 13:47:39




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
I ain't being a smarta**, but portland is "made", not mined. Using cement kiln, they add lime, some metals and a bunch of other stuff, heat it under open flame to about 1800 F, and it comes out in round balls (clinkers) which are then milled into powder or cement. It doesn't take many people to run a kiln, but they can only make so much. There's no such thing as running slow or fast...they just run and continuously.

Many now burn waste oils and hazardous wastes (solvents, paints, etc.) which is a really cheap fuel for them, and helps the waste disposal industry by making a home for stuff that otherwise would be pretty expensive to dispose of.

I just toured a cement kiln in Ohio a few month ago, and it's quite an operation...huge!! We were looking to them as a resource to burn scrap tires (which are really beneficial to their process) but they tell me they hardly buy any coal or gas anymore, but instead others pay to have their wastes burned.

Capacity hasn't changed, but their market has expanded dramatically overseas, and they've contracted a lot of their production for several months. Thus the "shortage" here...

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TimFL

07-23-2004 17:19:21




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 Re: Re: Concrete in reply to Matt Clark, 07-23-2004 13:47:39  
You are correct portland is "made" but it is made from mined products. It has to be made from something.
As far as the shortage: Link



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paul

07-23-2004 10:46:43




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
I think China from time to time would export cement. At this time, they are importing it. Makes a big difference.

China has put a lot of money & investment into a large dam project that should be coming on line in a year or 2. This will give them a lot of electricity & industrial capacity. They are ramping up to use this, so they are very active on purchasing lots of iron, cement, and other bulk raw materials. In a decade or so they will be selling a lot more manufatured materials on the world market. They will take over from Japan & Mexico as the production center of the world. Hope the job you rely upon for a paycheck is set up for that reality.

--->Paul

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markct

07-23-2004 09:08:59




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
think about it, yes its all natural mined stuff basicly, but its not all mined here, and even if it was then if the chinese or whoever bought a whole bunch we would have a shortage, steel is also a mined mineral, just like aluminum and most any other thing, yet we stil have shortages of those things too



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TimFL

07-23-2004 06:55:09




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
Yes it is an all mined components. The shortage is in portland cement. That is the important part. Alot of the portland we use is imported from other countries and is controlled by a few large companies. With China willing to pay a premium ships that would normally come to supply us are going else where which creates a shortage here. There are several large projects going on around the world requireing alot of portland.

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Keith-OR

07-23-2004 12:52:08




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 Re: Re: Concrete in reply to TimFL, 07-23-2004 06:55:09  
I really don't agree with your statement on shortage of Portland cement. It is mined only about 200 miles east of me , between Baker City and Ontario, OR. The last time I was by there 6 weeks ago. not to many cars in the parking lot. They built new plant some years back closed the old one down,it is still there. LOTS of lime in them mountains.Don't think they will be running out anytime soon. Cause all the mountains around that area is mostly lime deposits. Just my 2 cents

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Robert

07-23-2004 06:29:14




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 Re: Concrete in reply to tlak, 07-23-2004 06:03:06  
I think you're referring to cement, which is the "glue" that binds sand and gravel, making the mix "concrete".
There are shortages from time to time in the cement industry, when demand exceeds supply, and cement users are occasionally put on allocations.
Cement manufacturers generally are located where there is an adequate supply of raw materials.
There is always a high demand for U.S. manufactured cement----- WE MAKE THE BEST!

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