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Stupid Dad

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stan

08-29-2004 22:56:59

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I was driving by a field yesterday and saw a dad scraping a weeded lot, with his small daughter standing between the fender, and the seat. He didn't have his arm around her, holding the girl at all. Now that I look back I guess I should have stopped and said something.

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benuk

08-30-2004 09:03:21

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

the safest place to be when a tractor is operating is ON the tractor.

Yes, it would probably have been better for her not to be there at all, but if the dad needed to work, and there was no one else around to look after her then its better that shes there than walking around the field, or in the ouse on her own.

Me, (15) have spent many an hour getting a lift to a field on cabless tractors standing on the footplate holding onto the safety frame. Personally id rather be there than riding my bike along busy roads with idiots driving too fast and not looking where there goin because there talking on there phones.

just my opinion. Im expect my opinion would be different if youd said the grl had fallen off and died.

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paul

08-30-2004 19:07:52

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to benuk, 08-30-2004 09:03:21

RealRon has some rather unusual opinions on all this, little of which I can understand.

I think children should be taught responsibility - not locked away & forgotten - what a sad life RealRon leaves to family members!The best person to decide when a child is ready to accept some responsiblity is his or her parents. No one can learn responsibility locked in a house - you just grow up bitter & immature & don't know how to face the world when you finally get out & away from a bully of a father.

Different people react to tasks differently. As we see evidence here on the boards every now & then, there are many grown men that should _not_ operate a tractor!!!! While many 10 & 12 year old kids show plenty of maturity to handle specific tractor tasks.

Real Ron now wishes to lock women & children in the house while he is being manly..... Well, I guess I would have my 'manly' removed if I suggested that to _my_ family!!!!! ! :) :) :) My wife does a better job of plowing than I do, and there is less to fix when she is done. Perhaps she can lock me in the house?

I guess that is a round-about way to say I totally disagree with what little I can understand of RealRon's opinion on this topic. :)

Glad to hear your opinion, worth as much as anyone else's. :) Play & work safe, but live life.

--->Paul

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TheRealRon

08-30-2004 09:52:40

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to benuk, 08-30-2004 09:03:21

You are wrong!

The safest place to be when a tractor is in operation is in the house; which is precisely where my wife, kids, and dogs are when I'm working. That way I KNOW where they are and I KNOW that they will be safe and sound when I'm done.

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Mark - IN.

08-30-2004 16:56:29

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 09:52:40

When I head out to the barn, my family doesn"t go into the house, they leave the county. And so do my neighbors. Now that I think of it, the whole county leaves the county, except the volunteer fire department - they pretty much park in the drive and watch me, just like buzzards waitin to pick my bones clean, except that they usually just load me up and cart me off. I sure wish I had government health insurance.

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Redman

08-30-2004 16:04:19

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 09:52:40

so you would turn a 5 year old loose in the house all alone for a couple of hours while you do field work?
i suppose if you see smoke their must be a problem in the house too?
i don"t know why i didn"t think of that.

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Harley1983

08-30-2004 10:43:12

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 09:52:40

If you"d get your glasses changed you could see them, and if you told them to stay back in the yard or at least out of your way, they would respect you more Ron, and they would get to be out in nature which is why we"re on the farm isn"t it? And for the dogs, if they ain"t smart enough to stqay out from under loud, moving equipment, they are just tired of your s#@t too and are committing doggy Kari, Deal with it.

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Indydirtfarmer

08-30-2004 10:25:02

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 09:52:40

If you"re talking 20 minutes to cut the grass, then OK (sorta). BUT...My wife is my full-time combine operator. My son, now 25, was running equipment like an adult, by the time he was 14. Both HAD to learn by setting on or in a piece of equipment. No, I don"t believe in letting someone ride on a tractor like a toy, but there"s a time and place for "second riders". It"s a neccessity. I"d like to see the look on your face, after my wife got done with you, when you TRIED to tell her to stay in the house..... .That"d be priceless. John

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Paul in Mich

08-30-2004 11:34:22

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 08-30-2004 10:25:02

IDF, $5. will get you $10. that Ron's wife doesnt stay in the house just because HE tells her to stay there. I don't even know the man, but I bet Mrs Ron is equiped with a brain of her own and if she stays in the house its because sht wants to rather than that Ron tells her to.

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dhermesc

08-30-2004 12:11:01

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Paul in Mich, 08-30-2004 11:34:22

I don't know but I was EXPECTED to run the tractor (too small to pick up the bales) when I was 6 years old. When I was 9 I was a full time mower operator and was expected to both run and maintain the 40+ year old "H" I was running. Besides that its too damn hot to hang out in the house in the summer.

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Paul in Mich

08-30-2004 15:14:50

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to dhermesc, 08-30-2004 12:11:01

It was the same for me. Pa sat me on the Farmall A doing finish work, and raking when I was 7 yrs old. By the time I was 9 I was driving the MD and the Cat at 10. At 12 I rolled a Ford 8N, but it wasn't that I didn't know what I was doing wasn't dangerous, but a total misunderstanding of mortality. Farming in those days was a family venture, and everyone had their role beginning at pre-school age, even if it was nothing more than feeding the dog. I remember one of my first chores delegated by my Dad, and that was to carry the honey bucket out to the privy. That job had to be carried out without incident before Pa would allow more responsible jobs such as driving tractor.

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Ben uk

08-30-2004 10:18:04

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 09:52:40

If your a busy farmer, your dogs, kids and wife are hardly ever going to see daylight at some times of the year.

Just my opinion. You do what you feel is best, ill do what i feel is best.

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Mike(Wi)

08-30-2004 07:31:58

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Well, you have a point there. It probably isn't the safest thing to do, but I know that I spent many hours doing just that....I guess it doesn't bother me that much.

Is is any more dangerous then what I see every day on the freeway? Young mothers with their SUVs barreling down the road in heavy trafic at about 75....tailgating while jawing on those damm cellphones.

Yes, the kids are buckled in. Yes, they have airbags and ABS on their disc brakes.....However just because the vehicle is as safe as they can make it, they don't feel they have to pay attention when they drive. How much risk are they putting their kids at, and why doesn't anybody complain about that...?

Speaking of safety, if it SO important, then why haven't motorcycles been outlawed? That is and will always be a pretty high risk deal.

Personally, not against motorcycles. I think everyone should decide for themselves how much risk they want to take....but your point is well taken about looking after the safety of our children. I will try to remember that.

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The Dukester

08-30-2004 07:00:44

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

I'll tell you Stan, you did the right thing by minding your own business and putting up this post instead of trying to be "Dudley Do Right". I've let certain children and other people ride with me on tractors and other machinery....and once my younger brother got his foot pinched pretty bad in the cultivator linkage on a Farmall H, but he survived it without serious injury and he and I learned to watch out for possible danger areas we hadn't been aware of. But, when the time came for my brothers to operate the tractor and machines, they had a good knowledge of safe tractor operation and respect for the equipment they were asked to operate. This knowledge came mostly from the experience of riding on tractors with me and other older operators and observing how they were run safely and successfully. I personally know you don't learn how to drive a tractor by watching from the edge of the field or from some book or from verbal instructions before you mount up to run it yourself. But, you are right in your estimation that the little girl was in a dangerous situation and she shouldn't have been left to hold herself on safely or probably even be on the thing if the situation was as you described. I've felt the same way when I've seen small children and babies being held by their mother or father or someone while they were running a riding lawn mower or mower/tractor, it just made my blood curdle to think that adult or older person was that careless and ignorant. It makes my blood curdle when I see kids drunk and swaked out on drugs and crap too, looking like the street urchins their parents have let them become. On the other hand, if you ever had stopped by, stopped me on the tractor and told me I was stupid for allowing someone to ride with me on the tractor you would possibly have got punched in the nose....now, or past times. Calling someone stupid can get you a bloody nose or worse, you gotta use a little more tact than that, especially around farmers who don't like meddling people who look like "city types' telling them anything. I don't know however if you're a "city type" or a farmer, would I know if you approached me on my tractor to tell me I was stupid? Of course lawyers can be hired when you get punched in the nose and the legal system seems to just "hunger" for this type of molehill to build into a mountain. But that is stupid and doesn't fix anything except help the ripoff legal profession and bring about more government intervention into our freedoms. JMHO, you understand.

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stan

08-30-2004 16:06:31

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to The Dukester, 08-30-2004 07:00:44

I doube if I would called him stupid to his face, I am not that dumb. This person was a contractor scraping a lot to put another house in our area. I did grow up on a farm in the 50,s, and also pinched my foot in the cultivator linkage of Dad,s Farmall F 12 hert like the dickens, but no damage was done. We would ride everything that moved. I tryed hanging on to a harrow and got my arm caught and was drug a good distance before I disloged my arm. I didn,t want to holler cause I would have gotten my butt whipped for trying that stunt. I may have been around 5 years old. I also give my grand kids rides on my tractors, but at least I have a place for them to sit, and hold on to them. On my crawler there is enough room for two people to sit.

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Ryan

08-30-2004 06:23:17

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

My dad (who is now 60) told me when they raised hogs a couple miles of the road he would always set on the hood of the to20 up the road. The other day we were mixing concrete with it and he sat on the hood (260#"s) for old times sake I guess. Not really enough information for me to say wether I would have my child or not in the same position as the instance you speak of. I wouldn"t use one instance to label a person stupid, or a stupid dad. Just my two cents.

Ryan

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Red Dave

08-30-2004 06:18:12

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

You're right. Be glad you don't have any Amish in your neck of the woods. Their kids regularly are injured in farm accidents around here. Some of the dangerous things I have seen them do with their children make me shudder to think of.

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Paul in Mich

08-30-2004 06:14:02

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Stan, I dont doubt but what riding on a tractor leaning on a fender may be dangerous, but Im sure that most of us here responding have done the same thing or worse. I can remember at the age of 4 sitting on the toolbox of my Grandfathers Caterpillar and riding for hours. what amazes me, and I'm sure you've all seen it is parents will stick a helmet, which didn't even exist in our day, on their kid, and allow the kid to ride a bycycle without bothering to explain the rules of the road. The same kid will ride on the wrong side of the road, ride side by side with another cyclist with traffic at his back, ride at night without lights or reflectors, run pedestrians off the sidewalks and not think for a minute the danger they pose, because that stupid helmet is all they need. I guess stupid sticks out more when we see the other guy do it.

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Jimmy King

08-30-2004 05:56:31

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Stan, yes the man was stupid, but I spent hrs and hrs riding on the left axle of a B, the gas tank on a Super A, and know many others that did also. I am or was 5"51/2" tall now and I started driving a tractor when I was about 7. Pulling a bundle wagon when I was 9 all day 9,10 hrs, was so short I had to slide out on the edge of the seat holding the wheel tight so I could hold the clutch and brake while they threw on a shock. Then while I was wating if I had to, to change wagons at the seperator I would climb on top of the thrasher. I started my own son raking when he was about 9.

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buickanddeere

08-30-2004 05:40:02

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

I agree with Chris. Why do most people think " it will never happen to me"? As for Weir George, well yes if the Dad gets huffy. Just call the Childrens Aid society.

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Redman

08-30-2004 16:25:15

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to buickanddeere, 08-30-2004 05:40:02

there it is,everyone is entitled to their opinion,but some people think that in some was theirs is the only one that matters.
call who ever you would like,it is not against the law to let your children ride on equipment.
as for a safe ride in a tractor,their is no such thing,nor a safe car ride either.

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buickanddeere

08-31-2004 09:12:00

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Redman, 08-30-2004 16:25:15

There is the accepted level of risk. You can't seriously compare the injuries/deaths per hour properly strapped into a modern road vehicle. Vs a four year old perched on a boucing tractor. That fool dad needs to talk to a Dad who ran over thier own child. It's tough seeing those tread luggs pushed so deep into such a fragil little body that used to hug you and call you Daddy. If he still thinks it can't happen to him/his child. Have the law take the children away from the danger.

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Redman

08-31-2004 11:30:15

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to buickanddeere, 08-31-2004 09:12:00

again i will say,unless the child was in the seat with noone on it,it is legal.
most of todays laws as far as children go are just like the drinking laws and everything of the same nature,they all started out as a good idea,but people just take it too far.
i don't think a kid should be working a 40 hour a week job or nothing,but they should have to contibute to the family with some kind of chores.
and as far as me not being able to compare vehicle accidents to tractor accident is pure BS.
if a child is killed in a car is he or she any less dead than if killed on a tractor?
the fact of the matter is that a kid will be a kid and for some reason boys have less fear than girls,i have watched one of my sons decide the stairs just took too long to walk to the bottom and jumped from half way up,does this mean i should be sent to jail and my kids taken from me?
could the government take my kids?possibly,but i would not be around to know of it as i would be dead.
the thought of my kids being raised by a stranger that could be molesting them is enough to make me sick,bet you didn't think of that did you?
your thoughts are shared by many people and they have gotten their way for a long time,but take a look at the crime rate.
i don't know alot,but i do know that i have never ever gotten more money back at a store than i had comeing,if i do i tell them.
i would like for my kids to be raised this way,not your way.
a little advice for you,if you see a kid getting beat jump in and stand up for them.
but if you see a kid getting a ride on a tractor look the other way,the kid will have a low opinion of you too if you say anything.
call the cops?sure the kid will not hate you but will hate the law.

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kyhayman

08-30-2004 05:38:09

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Not one of the brightest ideas in the world for him to have her there. Also not a real bright idea to butt into someone elses business when not invited. I'd have not stopped either, no point in me being 'dead right'.

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Indydirtfarmer

08-30-2004 05:54:11

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Are we back in school yet? in reply to kyhayman, 08-30-2004 05:38:09

Howdy. Has school started back yet You still doing the Vo-Ag class? John

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kyhayman

08-30-2004 07:14:30

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Re: Are we back in school yet? in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 08-30-2004 05:54:11

Hey John!

We've been back in for almost 4 weeks now. I've got 2 shop classes and a biology class in the morning then play administrator in the afternoon.

You make it to the State Fair? Had 5 of my kids shop projects there, JD 1010 and an IH Cub, plus some small stuff.

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Indydirtfarmer

08-30-2004 09:12:24

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Re: Are we back in school yet? in reply to kyhayman, 08-30-2004 07:14:30

No fair this year. Our house is less than 5 minutes from an entrance to the fairgrounds. Would have loved to see that 1010. I know where there"s a PAIR of 2010"s for one money. (One runs, but bad tranny. Other good tranny-no motor)I"m thinking that I heard $800 for both. There"d be a good FFA project tractor. Have fun with the school! It"s fun being around kids. John

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kyhayman

08-30-2004 11:04:13

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Re: Are we back in school yet? in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 08-30-2004 09:12:24

The 1010 was one of our better projects, guy who's son did it wanted everything done right down to a scanned repro of the dealers decal. Personally, I would have preferred to use a high gloss paint rather than the OEM. Both tractors looked good though.

Good bunch of kids this year, 30 in each class.

On the 2010's. Have you done a transmission change in one before? OMG, one job I dont care to repeat, had to make tools to do it. Price sounds right though.

Regards,
David

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Indydirtfarmer

08-30-2004 05:29:40

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

You are a product of your environment. It hasn"t been that long, in the grand scheme of things, since there was children working in coal mines, factories, and FARMS. Most everyone that grew up on a farm, ended up doing something dangerous at one point. Some folks just grow to be an adult, and never see the problem with it. My son rode many an hour with me (in an enclosed cab) I"m sure he"s waiting untill his 4 year old son gets a chance to do the same. Not all of us get the same information growing up.....Can"t expect everyone to get it right..... Just don"t be the one who sets the bad example. JOHN

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Mike M

08-30-2004 05:02:31

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Darned if you do and darned if you don"t.

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TheRealRon

08-30-2004 04:53:59

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

I've been in your shoes and decided to not say anything for a reason... anybody stupid enough to do what he did is also too stupid to understand why it's stupid... trying to explain it to him would be as futile as trying to teach a pig to sing.

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Oinker

08-30-2004 05:55:18

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to TheRealRon, 08-30-2004 04:53:59

'Ole solo mio'

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rustyfarmall

08-30-2004 04:47:57

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

There are a whole bunch of us that spent countless hours riding with dad on a tractor that didn"t even have fenders. At least that way dad knew where we were, and didn"t have to worry about running over us.

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Nebraska Cowman

08-30-2004 03:20:50

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Don't be too critical. I know there are lots of that spent many hours with dad when we were small and we didn't all die. Sure there is a risk and some people do foolish things but still the parents need to spend time with their children. Mind your own business.

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08-30-2004 08:27:24

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 08-30-2004 03:20:50

Cowman, are you upset, or just showing some sarcastic humor? I"m afraid I don"t understand your post, and I would like to comment.

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08-30-2004 08:29:35

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to AC, 08-30-2004 08:27:24

I didn"t see the rest of the posts...cancel that last post.....AC

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Chris

08-30-2004 05:10:47

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 08-30-2004 03:20:50

As a child I spent lots of time on the fender of a tractor. That was then and I will assume we didn't know better. As an adult and member of the fire department, I have picked up two dead children in the past ten years. One fell from the back of the tractor and ended up in a corn picker and one from the front of fender and under the drive tire. In both cases the father felt he could catch the child if he fell off or get the tractor stopped in time, But when it actually happened it was so fast there was nothing the father could do. Today I would like to think we know better and would not do something so stupid as to risk your own childs life. There are plenty of other ways to spend quality time with your kids. As far as minding your own bussiness, what about the people involved in cutting a dead child out of some equipment and then having to explain to the rest of the family what happened? Seems they should have something to say about blatent stupidity!

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Redman

08-30-2004 05:44:01

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Chris, 08-30-2004 05:10:47

didja ever load a kid into a car and go for a drive?
life is full of risks and that is a fact,i was already behind the wheel when i was 8 and their was noone around me.
but i did get taught that the equipment was dangerous and dead is the end of it.
don"t fly too far off the handle,but when it is your turn it does not matter if you were on the fender of a tractor or sleeping in a bed.

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Indydirtfarmer

08-30-2004 04:27:58

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 08-30-2004 03:20:50

The mere fact that this thread exsist"s, is a statement unto itself..... ....John

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Weirdale George

08-30-2004 02:50:05

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to stan, 08-29-2004 22:56:59

Once saw a guy driving a tractor with his grand daughter sitting on the hood. Makes me cringe to think about it.

Do you stop and say anything about his stupidity? It is sad to say, but in this day and age, you could get shot for not minding your own business. Someone who cares so little about a child's life would even care less about yours!

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Buzzman72

08-30-2004 10:08:31

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Re: Stupid Dad in reply to Weirdale George, 08-30-2004 02:50:05

As a kid, besides working for Dad at the parts counter, I also worked for him in his custom mowing business. I spent a lot of time riding on the drawbar of a Cub with a Woods 42 belly mower, both with and without a PTO pulley shield. Dangerous? Probably. Did I get hurt? No. Before Dad would let one of us kids operate his tractors, we had to have completed at least one year of the 4H Tractor Maintenance program. In the safety area, the 4H program taught that thers should only be as many people riding on a tractor as there are seats...which usually meant the operator ONLY.

So was the dad in question being negligent with his child? Since I wasn"t there, I can only speculate. Is it my business? If there is no incident, I suppose not. MY business is how I raise and train MY kids...if I were responsible for HIS kids, I suppose he could send me his BILLS, too.

Just my opinion.

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