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City boy needs help on buying a used tractor....

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Scott in IN

07-24-2005 20:24:07

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Well, the wife and I just moved out onto 20 acres, 3-4 need to be mowed and the rest is woods with trails through them. I'm looking for a tractor that will pull a 6' finishing mower for the yard, 5' bush hog for the trails and have a front end loader along with a box blade for the 600' long drive way.

Anyhow, I initially thought I wanted a 8n or 9n but some of my more knowledgeable buddies talked me out of it. Then I started looking at some of the $8,000 compact Yanmars (20 hp at the pto) with a bucket. The tractors are still 20 years old and there might be a problem getting parts. Then we checked out some Mihandra (spelling) compact tractors at a local dealership, about $13,500 for what we wanted (which is what the wife wants since they are new with a warranty). Then I decided I would be best served with a used "real" utility type tractor (30-50hp) with a loader instead of a compact tractor (less expensive than the Mihandra). Most of my time will be spent mowing, clearing paths in the woods, moving dirt and landscaping material around with the bucket.

Thoughts from the group? Any older (70's or newer) tractors better than others? Any tractors to try and stay away from? I'm looking to spend between $5,000 and $8,000..

Thanks,
Scott

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WiCraig

07-25-2005 14:30:18

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

I had an 8n, great tractor and cheap parts. Now have a 1710 ford 4x4, heated cab, shuttle shift, loader. I also have 25 acres and a 1400' driveway. While the tractor is a little less than 30hp, good enough for what I want out of a tractor. You should be able to find either a 1710, 1910, or 2110 around your price range. Or a 20 series, a little newer model, but looks the same to me. Good luck.

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Nebraska Cowman

07-25-2005 10:34:53

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

If it were me, I'd buy a 35 massey ferguson. but it sounds like maybe your wife has her heart set on a new one. Wisdom says , don't fight her. And if you buy a new one and have trouble and it breaks... Don't say nothin' And when the warranty runs out and it's broke, and the parts are hard to get? just say "yes honey" and do the best you can.

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Rod in Smiths Falls, ON,

07-25-2005 10:23:54

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

You should be fine in that price range.

Talk to your new neighbours. They'll let you in on local prejudices about brands, dealer networks, and most importantly, the guy in the area who fixes old tractors cheaply and well.

They'll quite possibly put you onto a tractor looking for a home at moderate cost. Neighbours might even lend you implements until you get established in return for the occasional loan of the tractor for raking hay. A 30 to 40 hp machine with live P.T.O should do nicely. Low range is a must for bush hogging in unfamiliar territory.

A good old tractor doesn't depreciate, and you can always buy another one or two, so it doesn't have to do everything on your property.

A loader is handy but a nuisance on soft ground or in close quarters.

Snowblowing with a cabless tractor is a job for a real man (and a snowmobile suit, heavy mitts, plus helmet with face shield).

When you check out a used tractor, gas or diesel, make sure it starts well in all weather. A reluctant starter is a vexation to the spirit and a gumption killer.

Good luck in your search, and read everything you can find about tractor accidents and injuries, because the things are not foolproof.

O.K., I've gotta plug my 1961 Massey Ferguson 35 with Perkins diesel. It cost a bit less than you are budgeting and works willingly in all seasons when the ground is hard.

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ed1

07-25-2005 09:46:31

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

Before anyone can give your a good recomendation what are your tractor skills? and repair skills?

If you new to this and have limited repair skills, I would purchase a used Kubota BX2200 that you can get for around $10,000 used with a loader and 60" belly finishing mower. It will only be a couple of years old and starts fairly easy in the winter. You might have to add a block heater in the really cold days. This is a good starter tractor for you to get use to and learn about. Take a look at Northern Tool, Homers or TSC from the bush hog and box scraper.

After you get fimilar with this one go after a big one with a cab for those cold days. For your second tractor I'd look at a regular row crop tractor around 100hp with a cab like a JD 4230, IH 966, White 2-105, Ford 8600. Color wars sometimes determine the tractor Green, Red, Silver, or Blue.

If your good with tractors you'll make the right choice

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kippster

07-25-2005 09:24:25

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Kioti compact Diesels in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

My dad bought a Kioti model LK3054 diesel tractor about 7 or 8 years ago. He uses it for pretty much the same things that you will be "City Boy". He also has a backhoe for his that he bought especially for digging stumps. HA HA!!! Its 30 horsepower at the pto, has 540 and 1000 rpm pto, shuttle shift (8 forward and 8 reverse speeds), He bought it with the 4 wheel drive and turf tires and has had no trouble at all. Another thing, Kubota sold out a few years ago because all the engineers were using lighter steels and castings with "better engineering" in the new Kubota tractors. (They were smashing front axle housings left and right after this change took place!)The "Big Cheese" of Kubota told them that if they wanted to rip people off, that he would sell them the company. The "Big Cheese" sold out the company in Japan, but kept one factory in Korea that manufactured the parts for the old Kubota tractors. He put this factory back into production and put a different name on it and called it Kioti. I work with a guy that worked very closely with Kubota during that time, and now he works for Kioti. I actually helped a guy put a Kioti trans and clutch in a Kubota that kept destroying transmissions. EVERYTHING is the same, but the Kioti is heavier built.

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Galen

07-25-2005 10:27:04

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Re: Kioti compact Diesels in reply to kippster, 07-25-2005 09:24:25

odd - If you look at the history of Kioti - it mentions that they have be Daedong since 1947. They also build some of the new Cub Cadets (this is why they have quality issues). Don't want to get into a war, but IMHO, Kioti is not a very heavy duty machine, BIL has one and 2 friends USED to have one. All of them are lawn mowers with big wheels. Cheaply built, over priced. Just my opinion, you are intitled to yours, too! 8^)

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Steve Mahler

07-25-2005 06:52:19

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

The real answer is that one machine to do everything is not perfect, but is expensive. I think a Ford 3000 or other color equivelent is way too big to use with a finish mower to take care of residential grass. It is also a bit big for trials in the woods, unless God planted your trees further apart than mine :)

I vote for the compact diesel route- I have had 2 20+yr old japanese compacts, they run forever and can do lots of work in small places. Not the machine for acres and acres of field work, but that is not how you describe your property.

The most taxing thing you mention might be the driveway - you will want some weight for that. The modern Kubota B and L series are too light in my opinion, so I like the Mahindra because of their heavy build. the suggestion of the 4500 was a good one, the footprint is not too big for woods, but should be heavy enough for 5 or 6ft brush hog, and a heavy box blade. Lastly, you didnt mention whether you are mechanically inclined. Asked another way, how big is your tool chest? If it doesnt have wheels, you may not be ready for an antique tractor :)

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John (MO)

07-25-2005 06:40:44

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

Scott, if you want to buy new, then I would consider the Mahandra 4500 series. If you want used, look for Massy, Ford or JD. I would strongly suggest you stay away from all compacts, they are big lawn mowers and seldom hold up well to much use or age. A lot should depend on dealers in your area. You WILL need parts at some point and dealer support is important. If it were me, I would not consider any tractor that did not have a CAT 2, 3 point hitch available from the factory. If only a CAT 1, 3 point was available it is a lighter tractor than I would want. The 8N Fords were OK tractors when they were new, but lack many features and power that is available in tractors that aren't all that much newer. They have somehow obtained a status above what they really are an above what they really are worth. A tractor big enough to do most of the non-yard work that you speak of, is going to have and need real tractor tires, these are hard on a lawn when you mow if there is much moisture in the ground. However a tractor with turf tires isn't going to have much traction to do the other things you mention. You may still need a lawn mower to use even with a tractor and large finish mower. Will just depend on how really well you want your lawn to be. With a tractor of 40 hp, you will have the weight and power you need with out having to have 4 wheel drive. Use a sight like www.ironsearch.com to see what tractors like 3000/4000 Fords etc are selling for.

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Leroy

07-25-2005 05:42:31

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

You don't say anythink about the teraine (Hills) or if you are in a flat part of the state. Indiana has some what I would call mountains with very steep slopes and also some very flat land so that is your first consern, hills or flat? then Indiana has areas that get 12 foot deep snow drifts so that is your next question, how do you plan to plow the snow, rear blade, front blade, blower, loader, combination? This will all afect the type of tractor you need. More information is needed before a good responce is able to be given.

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Mike M

07-25-2005 05:38:33

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

You would be suprized at how much work a little tractor with hydrostat 4x4 and a loader can do. I would opt. for the newer tractors but would buy one that was a few years old with low hours and good home. Let someone else take the first hit on depreceation. I would also stay with a name brand like JD,NH,Kubota for future resale and parts.

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Galen

07-25-2005 06:03:30

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Mike M, 07-25-2005 05:38:33

Ditto on the name brand! My BIL has a new Kioti yuppie tractor (overgrown lawnmower). Parts are back ordered all over the country and he can't get much. Stay with ones you know will be here 30 years from now (parts AND your tractor). There are a lot of good deals out there for under $10,000. Dig for awhile, decide EXACTLY what your uses/needs are and SHOP AROUND. If you are patient, things will happen.

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evilboweviel

07-25-2005 05:03:23

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

MF 35,135 with two stage clutch for Live PTO (opt) and PS (opt).
Oliver 550 standard IPTO, PS (opt)
Ford 3000,4000 3cyl (late model) engine, IPTO (opt?) PS (opt?)
Case ??
International ??
JD ??
MM ?? there are good ones out there, look the front end over close for how much wear the loader has done
mid to late 60"s and newer. MF and Oliver can be older
there are good units out there keep looking until you find one. There are a lot of worn out, broke up and DuPont overhauls out there.
Good luck
Ron

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VaTom

07-25-2005 04:57:38

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

Scott, around here you'd need to fatten your budget. For your price you'd be lucky to find an orphan compact. That front bucket's the problem.

You pretty much need 4x4 to do much work with one. I've easily outworked larger 2x Deeres and Fords with my compact because of it.

At that price in our market you might get lucky and find a Mitsubishi, which is few and far between for dealers, but do have parts readily available.

I'd suggest spending more and getting a standard 4x4.

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Galen

07-25-2005 04:55:48

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

Well - the Ford 3000-4000 models are in that price range around here (Nebraska), but don't know about where you're at. They make an excellent acreage tractor. Look into the IH 444 and 584 series (and other close series). On another note - I have a 1949 8N that I use constantly for mowing, blading, discing, plowing, snow removal, PHD, and a HOST of other stuff. I have a loader that works well with it. Neighbor a few miles over uses his for everything - he farms 3/4 of the 320 acres he owns with one. They aren't for everyone/thing, but they do more than people think.

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txgrn

07-25-2005 04:47:01

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

I think you passed the initial test. My neighbor's experiences with the little guys with all the whistles and bells is that they are way too many for the engine size. It is just overwhelmed and provides little functionality. You have to get over 30hp to get up where they can handle all that stuff.

I'm going to do this color blinded so pick your color. Think hard about what you said you are going to do with it. The loader is neat when you use it but always in the way when you aren't. If you had one with a quick attachment feature it would be nice so that you can take it off when not used.

There are numerous "utilities" out there. They are built low to the ground, and easy to get on and off. With the tires set out somewhat they are usually pretty stable. Roll Over Protection (ROPS)is a great idea and can be outfitted with a hood and provide shade from the sun..... but you can't mow under trees very well.

Power steering is helpful for the misses but more to keep running and something else to fix. If you get the loader you need it.

Gas or diesel. Had both. My fleet is now all diesel. Just do better on a day to day basis. Cost more to fix than gas granted, but once you get the bugs out they run a long time. May be a little finickey in the winter but there are easy ways to combat that.

3 pt lift is a must.

Live or Independent PTO very desirable. If you ever used one and then use a PTO like on a Ford n series, you'll immediately see what I mean.

I like to look at little things to see how a tractor is cared for...if it looks rough, it probably is. Those with clean sheet metal and other things in generaly good conditions, tight steering, brakes that work, grease fittings showing lube help tell you that the major components may have been cared for also. New paint is pretty but you have to look beyond that. It's easy for us to think that "if it looks good it is good". Gotta ask yourself what did it look like before the cosmetic affair.

A good balance between functionality and price is mid '70's to mid '80's. You are new enough to get a lot of goodies and hopefully low hours, yet old enough to benefit from depreciation.

Good luck.

Mark

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Truetramp

07-25-2005 00:21:25

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

First of all, sit down with the mrs. an really go over what your going to be doing with the tractor(an make sure she can run it too) now if you plan on plowing snow with it, it'll need a barn with a block warmer an possibly a heated cab, with a 600 foot drive you can easily become lost an not found till Spring. Buying a tractor is a sort of looking into the future thing, an since your not getting any younger power steering an heated cab an such are things to take in mind. Some people love gas, an others like me just love the smell of diesel. But if you buy new, you'll have to buy the attachments as you go on. An a mower posthole digger scraper blader an plows an front buckets are not cheap. So look for a fairly new but not to old of one for better results, not in less your a mechanic welder lathe operator an machine repair man..... ...Rick

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08-09-2005 07:55:59

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Davis In SC

07-24-2005 22:15:57

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

Just for reference .. on tractor prices, a local JD dealer had an ad in the paper a few weeks ago... 50 hp Jdeere, w/ FEL & rotary mower, $17,500 for 60 months @ 0% interest.....

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Roy Suomi

07-24-2005 21:07:37

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Re: City boy needs help on buying a used tractor.. in reply to Scott in IN, 07-24-2005 20:24:07

I'm a sap for industrial tractors. All have power steering, All have heavy front axles and spindles. i.e. Deere 300 series tractors [ 300 , 300-B , 302....400 series tractors 400 , 401 , 401-C ...Ford 3400, 3500.. Good clean ones might be hard to find, but they're out there.If I were looking for a 4 wheel drive unit I would probably go with a Ford 1910 , 1920 or 2110 or 2120. These are some tuff little tractors and handle loaders well. Industrial 4 wheel drive loaders are going to cost dearly. Well that was my 2 cents worth, good luck..

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