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Fuel Prices

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bulls eye

08-20-2005 07:07:42




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Think about this for a minute. Is it about time the goverment takes over the oil business in this country? Those huge profits that the oil companies are collecting could go to the road funds there-by eliminating the MF taxes, if we are running short on fuel it could be rationed that would lower the demand and reduce prices. There would be only one customer from our county which would give us more purchasing power on the gobal market. Sooner or later if we keep demanding our goverment to fix all of our problems this is what will happen.
There is never a new goverment program involving give aways, that does not exert some type of new control. We the people need to either use a lot less fuel or band together and provide competition for these big profit groups,(build our own refinery) or buy their stock ;then you can afford these high prices

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JMS/MN

08-23-2005 11:33:07




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Government is the epitome of efficiency? Rationing does not control demand- it just creates a black market for product. Your post contradicts itself- you want more government and more control, then say we should buy oil stock so we can get some money back with shared profits? Sounds like my neighbor who advocated our county buying asphalt equipment and hiring help to blacktop our roads- cheaper than letting competitive bids. Hadn't heard about the latest Chinese invention- a shovel that stands by itself, so we don't need to hire someone to lean on them.

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TommyD

08-22-2005 09:11:12




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 Re: Fuel Prices - You're misguided in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
I work for a major oil and your ideas are misguided. Gas prices are being driven by Wall street, not the oil companies or even supply and demand. The government could step in a variety of ways, but none are good in the long run. Promoting stability in oil producing nations will calm investor fears and bring prices back down or investors will get comfortable with the chaos and the prices will come down. it's just a matter of time. In the meantime, the higher prices are causing car companies to think more about producing more efficient, cleaner vehicles. Evnetually, that will create a decline in the demand for gasoline and prices will come down that way. The oil companies want prices to be stable, wherever they wind up. We lose our shirts when prices are rising because competition doesn't allow us to raise street prices fast enough to overcome increasing costs. I understand your view and hear it all the time, but it's simply wrong. Anyone may e-mail me if you want more information.

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paul

08-21-2005 07:43:56




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
We are is deep doo doo if we let the govt run the oil companies.

All bulk commodities go through cycles of net losses, net record profits. The marketplace is self-regulating. Hogs sold for 80 cents a lb, and 8 cents a lab in the past couple of decades. I've sold corn for $1.20 a bu & $4.14. Soybeans for $4.07 & 12.00.

At $3 a gallon, gas use will stablize, folks will ecconomise, we are getting to fall in a couple of weeks & folks will stay home. Gas prices will return to a sane price again. All on their own.

Don't let the govt get involved. Bad, bad idea.

Make a difference. When was the last time you had your tire pressure checked? An engine tuneup? Combine your trips, turn your thermostat up or down a bit?

that would have a far more drastic effect on energy prices than govt involvement.

Keep the govt out.

--->Paul

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Mark - IN.

08-21-2005 06:58:47




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Hmm? Government run businesses? Russia, China, and countless other communist countries. Not for me. I'll take my chances on supply and demand, free market, and other technologies. Besides, can you name one thing the government's gotten their fingers into that they didn't f...up? Not me.

Mark



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MSD

08-20-2005 22:46:46




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  

A small town gas stop filled its tanks on Wed. evening. Gas went from $2.43 to $2.55. Ok, it cost more than the last load. At 8 am it is $2.55. At 5pm it is now $2.63. They did't pump them tanks dry in one day, but are now making another .08 a gallon just because they can. I buy at Flying J for $2.54.



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Dave 2N

08-20-2005 17:54:50




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Last thing we need is the gov't. sticking it's you-know-what into one more place it doesn't belong.



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txgrn

08-20-2005 16:36:33




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Grow up sucker. Government control is dooms day.

Mark



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Mark - IN.

08-20-2005 23:47:38




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to txgrn, 08-20-2005 16:36:33  
Hey Mark, can you do me a favor? Never been to the Kountry Life Board until just a few ago. You just retired, and I just posted there. Can you take a look and tell me what you think? When you see the topic, you'll understand. Thanks buddy.

Sorry to butt in here all, was lookin for Mark and didn't know any other way.

Mark



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txgrn

08-21-2005 07:10:26




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Mark - IN., 08-20-2005 23:47:38  
Done



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Mark - IN.

08-22-2005 18:19:14




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to txgrn, 08-21-2005 07:10:26  
I saw it Mark. Thank you Sir.

Mark



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Jonfarmer

08-20-2005 14:08:25




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
The goverment really can't do much of anything to reduce the cost of oil because it is FOREIGN OIL, as in, not from the USA and out of the U.S goverment control, what is it that you think they could do?. That would be like you having a car for sale for $5,000 and the guy down the street demanding you sell it to him for $2,500 when the car is worth $5,000, are you going to do it?, absolutly not and the guy down the steet has no control over what you do with the car.
Ron 1456 is right about there being more drivers than ever before, and lets not forget everything else that uses oil, such as the plastics industry. The world population is rapidly increasing and oil is something that is precious and the price will only continue to go up as oil becomes harder to get and the demand gets higher. The world is going to run out of oil eventually and depending upon what source you read from, it's predicted not too far off into the future.

What we need to do is look into alturnative fuel sources to wean ourselves off oil. I've heard people complain of the Alaskan oil reserves not being tapped into, it's because the enviromental impact would be huge and there is only enough oil there to go a short period of time, then after that what is America to do?. I like knowing the oil is there and save it for a rainy day such as what if another world war broke out and Europe refused to sell oil to us?, we'd be in a real fine mess as we wouldn't have any fuel to power our war vehicles. I also hear people complain about how bad and stupid the EPA is, lets not forget that the EPA's 1 and only goal is to protect the enviroment, the air that you and I breath, thats worth alot to me and it should to you. Without a heathy enviroment we could not live, air quality is getting worse all the time and the EPA does it's best to improve it, without their guidelines that they hold the automaker to, the automaker would not make the improvments on their own and things would be alot worse.

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Ron 1456

08-20-2005 12:28:16




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
The oil companies don't control the fuel prices. The fuel price is controlled by the people, businesses, funds, etc. that. invest in the comodity markets such as the NYMEX where crude oil, gasoline, heating oil, and other energy products are traded. The oil companies are just cashing in on a market that is high right now. They are making more money now just like I do when the corn and soybean markets are high. Prices are high because demand is high. Demand is high because there are more drviers and more automobiles than ever before. There are more trucks moving more products than ever before. We have an over zealous EPA that makes unrealistic regulation which hurt fuel mileage. We have a hugh airline industry that wastes millions of gallons of fuel. Air travel is the least fuel efficient form of transportation yet people think nothing of flying to save time. If you want fuel prices to come down ther are a few things you can do to help the situation. Drive a fuel efficient vehicle. Don't make unneccessary trips. DON'T FLY. Vote the people out of office who vote for overboard regulations. I'm not a big fan of the oil companies but they are just enjoying a market that is good for them right now.

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Paul in Mich

08-20-2005 17:28:33




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Ron 1456, 08-20-2005 12:28:16  
"BINGO"..... ..Ron, you are so right on the money.



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Tim Shultz

08-20-2005 12:45:25




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Redmud, 08-20-2005 11:23:03  
HEAR HEAR!!! *grin* Thats saying it!



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Russ(NM)

08-20-2005 10:52:53




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 Ten Cents per Gallon in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
I read about a year ago that refineries average about ten cents per gallon net profit on gasoline. This is a lot less than the federal and state governments make from it.



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Sloroll

08-20-2005 10:37:13




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Using that rational the Gov. should be making Cornflakes too.



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Demand

08-20-2005 17:29:41




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Tom in TN, 08-20-2005 09:56:41  
DEMAND!!!...With out the demand the Oil companies, advertizers, gas refineries, state taxes, etc.. would all have to suck it up and deal with lower profits. If it cost you more to grow your corn, and people refuse to buy it at a higher prize then you would have to keep your prize low or eat all the corn yourself.
Of course if demand was lower, the cost would never have increased.



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Tom in TN

08-20-2005 17:59:24




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Demand, 08-20-2005 17:29:41  

Hello Demand,

Thanks for the note. I actually am fairly familiar with the supply/demand relationship. What puzzles me is that the explanation that I keep hearing is that the price of crude oil has reached all time highs, therefore, the price of gasoline has increased commensurately. I don't know the answer to the question, but I'd sure like to know the relationship between the cost of the oil that is used to produce a gallon of gas, versus the dramatic increases that we see in the price of the gas.

Do you think that each factor in the price is increasing simultaneously or is that only some of them are increasing? I'd just like to know the facts.

Thanks again,

Tom in TN

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Demand

08-20-2005 18:41:49




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Tom in TN, 08-20-2005 17:59:24  
I believe its all about maximizing profits. If you ran a produce stand and told your customers that the farmers cost went up 50% and therefor you had to increase your prices 50%, then as long your customers continue buying just as much produce then you would not lower your price. I know thats hypothetical but assume their were more than just the farmer and the produce stand owner involved in getting the produce to the customers, e.g. shipping, warehouse, marketing, and middleman. If the middleman paid the farmer 50% more for the produce, well it didn't cost 50% more to ship it, or store it or advertise it, it actually cost 50% more of 25% of the operation or in assence his cost went up 12.5%. you would think that the middleman would then charge the produce owner 12.5% more for the produce, but remember we are maximzing profits. Know imagine that if everone was always talking about the high price of produce and it was on the news and in the paper everyday, also image that demand was so high for produce that the produce stand owner couldn't keep his product in stock. Well then the middleman could increase his price by 50% or more and the produce man will still buy and it increase his price by 50% or more as long as he can still sale it and make as much money or more money. If the consumer refuses to pay the extra price for the produce then the produce stand owner would not sale as much and therefor will reduce his demand for the product from the middleman. The middleman would have to reduce his price to encourage the produce stand owner to buy more. Its a lot like a big silly game each industry involved in getting the product to the consumer tries to maximze his profit including the farmer. Or in the case of gasoline the crude oil manufacturer. If the crude oil manufacturer can increase his price and still maintain the same or higher profit he will continue raising his price untill profits drop back. Each company along the process continues this process all the way to the convience store owner who actually sells the gas to the consumer. The drawback for the mom and pop convience stores is that cost has gone up so much by the time the gasoline gets to the store they are struggling to make a profit and keep the gas at a competitive price. It all falls back to demand. If demand drops the convience store sells less gasoline and therefor will not have as much gas delivered to the store from the gasoline company. The gasoline company must therefor reduce their price to continue selling the product, this backward cycle continues all the back to the crude oil manufacture.

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North of Linoma Beach

08-20-2005 08:27:10




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
I wonder if you spend as much time wondering about the profits of ADM, or Cargill, or General Foods, or Kraft? Are you happy getting less than a nickle out of each loaf of bread or box of cereal? I guess you "farmers" who grow 3 acres of pigweed or 1/2 bushel of organic road apples just don't have enough clout to influence Bunge, ADM, or whoever to pay more for your grain or livestock or whatever.
Now there's something worth bitching about, but most of you have the attitude that if your neighbor cuts back, why, by GOD, I'll just plant that much more, then you can't figure out why you're making less money now than you were 50 years ago. You don't want govt. price supports, you don't want imports, then who will get the blame next?
Next time your in the coffee shop, I'll bet the old boy that is making money isn't there with you.

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VADAVE

08-20-2005 14:41:58




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to North of Linoma Beach, 08-20-2005 08:27:10  
Yup!
So just how does the oil companies do it? Why they organize and agree on how the pricing will be done. Is that illegal? No because they atre not setting prices but HOW the pricing will be done.
To follow North of Linoma Beach's logic the farmers MUST organize (How?) and then take control of the pricing and supply. Right now noone is willing to give up that little bit of control and accept a limit on how much they can grow which then leads to how much we can charge. Another way to look at it or approach it--Can everyone afford to not grow anything for one year? My guess is too many are in hock to the banks and the seed/fetilizer/equipment companies to survive.

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Sid

08-20-2005 09:20:54




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to North of Linoma Beach, 08-20-2005 08:27:10  
I agree with North of Linoma Beach.



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yep

08-20-2005 09:38:40




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Sid, 08-20-2005 09:20:54  
i think North of Linoma Beach nailed it.



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Paul in Mich

08-20-2005 18:03:48




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to yep, 08-20-2005 09:38:40  
Nailed What?????..... ..... I see not a cintilla of logic in his statement. Most of all the reference to "YOU FARMERS".



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Edwin,Ky

08-20-2005 07:47:57




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to bulls eye, 08-20-2005 07:07:42  
Have you known, that we have the oldest refineries of the whole world here ? Where is all the money gone, we´ve paid for our fuel??? Why don´t we have the technologies to make the refineries more effective? Who´s taken the money? GW, Condoleeza, Rumsfeld or anyone else???



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Dug

08-20-2005 09:42:24




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Edwin,Ky, 08-20-2005 07:47:57  
While you are correct in pointing to our refineries as one of the problems, how in the world does W fit in? Is he leading the evironmentalists opposing the building of new refineries? Please enlighten me.

Dug



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sawtooth

08-20-2005 09:42:06




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Edwin,Ky, 08-20-2005 07:47:57  
A few days ago on the news I heard the government is reported saying "this is not a new problem, it's been in the making for decades". In other words don't blame this administration. I tend to look at it the other way, if it's a problem that's been foreseen decades ago why wasn't something being done about it.. decades ago?



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Joe in MN

08-20-2005 14:53:44




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to sawtooth, 08-20-2005 09:42:06  
THE ANSWER IS,,,,,BECAUSE OF GREED..... ....



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Paul in Mich

08-20-2005 17:25:39




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Joe in MN, 08-20-2005 14:53:44  
Greed, I agree, but on whose part we may differ 180deg. out of phase. Just whom do you see as the purveyors of the most "GREED" here?



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Ol Chief

08-21-2005 04:29:53




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 Re: Fuel Prices in reply to Paul in Mich, 08-20-2005 17:25:39  
I must have missed the boat!I continuly hear the media and others talking about the age of or lack of refineries having to do with oil prices at the pump.What does the refinery have to do with the cost of the crude raw product.Since last summer has the number of cars increased in proportion to the price of either crude oil or refined product?Also has everyone forgotten that we are at war with people that hate us.We are attempting to start a freedom movement in a region of kingdoms that control oil prices.Does anyone believe that the rulers there agree to democracy.My belief is that their way is (make em pay),thus higher crude prices.On The other hand (Value Wise ),I paid $1.79 plus tax for a cup of coffee at an IHOP restaurant last week in Houston,Tx.What is involved in the cost of making a cup of coffee or a glass of tea at $ 1.75. What would this make a gallon of coffee cost,Go figure. Back to the main subject, I have long wondered where the oil from Iraq is going and if they are of any help to the USA in this present oil price rise and is Iraq a member of OPEC, the people in control of crude oil prices.

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