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Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ?

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jdemaris

02-09-2006 10:29:05

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Maybe I'm getting old, but I used to think words meant something, and when put together into a sentence or phrase, connote even more. I just went looking for some injectors for one my 6.2 (Detroit built) diesel Chevys and also my 94 Ford with the turbo-diesel 7.3 (IH) engine. Shouldn't be complicated I thought. I used to work in a diesel shop, so I know a little. Went to Ebay, and found several diesel shops selling "remanufactured" and "new" injectors. What a bunch of bullsh*t! One place down south, describes injectors that are remanufactured - not just "cleaned up." So I call to order them, and guess what - NO new parts. Just cleaned up and tested yet advertised as "remanufactured." The guy then offers to sell me "new" injectors, that are actually old injector bodies with new tips - which is what a "rebuilt" injector is - in my mind. I called another place that has an ad on Ebay for "new" injectors at $18 apiece, no shipping charge, for 7.3 diesels, turbos and non-turbos. This place is in Canada. So, I call - and the guy gives me a price of $239 for eight, plus shipping. Hmmm, something wrong here. 8 X 18 = $239 plus shipping ?? So, I called back, and asked if maybe the mixup what based on the Canadian exchange rate? Nope. Just bullsh*t, take it or leave it. I found this repeated with just about every place I tried to order from. So, I ask, has the English language and commonly used mechanical terms changed all of a sudden? And, are these diesel shops all getting together and getting crooked in unison?

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Tyler in SD

02-10-2006 07:26:36

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

jdemaris, there are some injectors for sale at a good place called>Link

Tyler

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Mike M

02-10-2006 05:59:59

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

At our dealership we do very little truck work and NO diesels at all. So I have really no experience in what GM's injectors actually are.They should all have a 1 year warranty.

I looked in the electronic parts catalog (all Gm stuff is in there)And let me tell you it's clear as mud ! For the 6.2 I came up with at least 4 part numbers depending on year and applications. Some they call injectors and others they call nozzles so GM can't even decide what to call them. The 'new'ones are list price of $83.36 ea.I could sell them at trade of $58.00 they fit from 1991-1999 depending on applications. All the others are 'reman' and have lists of $115.79 these say with holder ? and from 1983-1988 and from 1988-1990 $94.00 and $81.00 possibally 2 different sources for the same thing ? So in conclusion proof positive that even the OEM can't tell you what you are getting ! Very confusing indeed !

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J. Schwiebert

02-09-2006 16:34:06

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

I agree with you. Did you get my note(e-mail) on the A-C engine?

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jdemaris

02-09-2006 17:14:00

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to J. Schwiebert, 02-09-2006 16:34:06

Yes I did get your message, and thanks for the input. In regard to the HD4 engine being used in a wheel tractor - I don't think so. The HD3 uses the same 175 c.i. engine as the D15 wheel tractor, but the HD4 use a 200 c.i. engine as do a few combines and the 615 wheel-backhoe-loader. I've heard a few comments about the Allis D-17 possibly using it - but as far as I know, they used six cylinder engines, not fours. It's possible the AC 200 c.i. engine originally came from Buda, just as the 344 c.i. engine in the HD6s did - but that's only a guess. The later 200 c.i. engine in the HD4s became called the 433 instead of the D2200, but I don't know why. The only change I know of was in the head - all the seat and valve-face angles were changed to 30 degrees. You also mentioned the new number maybe being metric. You might be correct. A 200 c.i. engine is 3,257 c.c.s or 3.2 litre. So, maybe the 433 means four cyliner and 3300 c.c.s?

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B-maniac

02-09-2006 14:21:56

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

They do it for two reasons; Lack of HONEST competition and because they can.Sucks but unfortunately the whole world is heading that way.

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Mike M

02-09-2006 12:07:12

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

Nope it's not you that's for sure ! I think those injection pump places always were in cahoots. If you just needed a gov. weight retainer put in you had to pay full price for a rebuilt exchange unit. Back around 1985 JD was selling brand new roosamasters for very little more than the local pump shops were wanting for rebuilt units.

Even the auto companies can't be consistant on what to call something. I work at a GM dealer parts dept. now and between the parts cat. service manual and price sheet they all call the same thing something different.

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jdemaris

02-09-2006 13:07:51

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to Mike M, 02-09-2006 12:07:12

I had some experience with what you mention. I've worked for Chevy and Deere dealerships. I was working at a Deere dealership when GM came out with the 5.7 litre diesel built on the Oldsmobile 350 gas engine platform - 1978 maybe? There were many problems, one of them being the plastic weight retainer ring falling apart in the governor on the Roosamaster/Stanadyne pump. The local Chevy dealer didn't have anybody with diesel experience, so we were doing their warranty work. There were times we had more Chevy/GMC pickups in the shop than Deere tractors - all with head gasket failures or crapped out injection pumps. At the time, Roosamaster claimed that those pumps were industrial, and not built to take the high under-hood temperatures when used in cars and pickup trucks. What a load of nonsense. We had them going bad in our Deere tractors also. At first, GM had Roosamaster change the materials used to make the seals and rings. Then later, the plastic ring got eliminated and replaced with the EID unit (1985-86?). Also, at the time, with the Deere equipment, we could buy brand new injection pumps from Roosamaster for $575, and at the same time, many shops were charging $675 for a rebuild. I will say one thing in defense of diesel repairers. The ones that charge a flat-rate on pump repairs, make out real well on most pumps, but loose money on others - thus the flat rate. If you are the poor chump sending in a pump that needs $40 in parts, and paying a $700 repair bill -well, not so good for you. But, some other guy sends in a pump with a seized head & rotor, and it needs $600 in parts (almost not worth fixing), he makes out like a bandit. Since you work for a GM dealer - here's another gripe. I went down to my Chevy dealer to buy some OEM exhaust pipes for my diesel Suburban. They cost more than aftermarket, but have always been much better quality - usually double walled and last three times as long as a NAPA pipe. Well, I went down to pick them up for my 92 Suburban, and they are thin walled, plain steel, Walker pipes - same junk that NAPA sells. So, I refused to take them. Is GM doing that with everything or just the older stuff?

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Mike M

02-09-2006 16:53:46

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 13:07:51

Alot of the stuff has at least 2 different part numbers. They are offering a less expensive version on some stuff. They are always changing suppliers and packages. They have alot of room to drop their price from list ! Most other parts places I worked ,JD,Navistar,Kubota you had 30-40% GM list is 100% Try to get them to give you dealer trade price.

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Harley

02-09-2006 11:58:40

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to jdemaris, 02-09-2006 10:29:05

Na jd, they're not getting together. And it's no conspiracy. It just happens to be the stuff YOU need that goes sky high. Trust me, if I need something, that is the week they either don't have it, can't get it, or the price just went up due to foreign intervention of one kind or another. Harley

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jdemaris

02-09-2006 12:52:35

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Re: Remanufactured diesel fuel injectors? ? in reply to Harley, 02-09-2006 11:58:40

My complaint isn't about the price. It's about misrepresenting what is being sold. Take my present situation. I want to replace my injectors with something that will equal the service life of the originals. That means either a totally new injector, or a rebuilt with a new tip installed. Both will provide the same service life if done properly since, in either, all the moving parts are new. I am looking for best deal, but am willing to pay whatever the market price is. Again, my complaint is NOT knowing what the H*ll is actually being sold - since many of the descriptions are bogus. If you take an injector, clean it and test it, it is NOT remanufactured, period. Call it "cleaned up", "checked", "good used", even "refurbished", but NOT rebuilt, and NOT remanufactured. I had started out looking for new injectors. The last set I bought came from Midwest Diesel. They had non-turbo 6.9 diesel injectors advertised as NEW, so I bought them. They were, just as advertised, NEW. That should NOT be a surprise. So, now I'm looking for injectors for my turbo 7.3, and NEW doesn't mean NEW anymore (with some people). Same goes for REBUILT. There is an ad right now on Ebay from Diesel Care in Memphis, Tennessee. The ad reads "You are bidding on a 6.9L / 7.3L remanufactured diesel fuel injector. These injectors are complete remanufactured and not merely cleaned and tested." So, I called them and tried to verify that the injectors have new tips. I was told "probably not" and I'd have to buy new if that's what it want. I've worked at diesel shops and Deere and Chevy dealerships, and never have I, or anybody else I've worked with ever had the nerve to call something rebuilt when it's simply been cleaned up and tested.

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