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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Delco-Remy Generator

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jac

05-13-2006 06:49:37




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Trying to test the generator off my JD 440ICD crawler. Plate on the generator is not in great shape but it appears to be a Delco Remy 02102 generator, I think. There are 3 terminals on the generator. One terminal for each brush and one appears to go to the field magnet. There is also another bolt that appears to be a case ground(?). My manual on the machine indicates only two termimals "A" and "F" so either I am missing something or this is not the original generator.

What is the best way to test if this is working? I should be able to hook it up to a battery and run the generator as a motor. Anyone know where I can find a wiring diagram for this?

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frankiee

05-13-2006 20:02:18




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 06:49:37  
Link
There is a link going to YT for a 3 brush Gen.
I am not saying I nkow how one works but maybe you have one and just cant see the 3rd brush.
Or maybe not.



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jac

05-13-2006 15:33:55




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 06:49:37  
Thanks for the information. The plate is damaged so I could not read the first numbers. The machine is a 12V positive ground. The confusion is that the generator definately has three terminals. Looking in the end of the generator, I can see that one terminal connects to the field coil. So that is the "F" terminal. The other two terminals each connect to an armature brush. So it appears I have two "A" terminals, one for each brush. That is what is causing the confusion for me. I was also expecting just one "A" terminal.

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Glen in TX

05-13-2006 16:00:11




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 15:33:55  
Hmmmm still 3 terminals on generator. I'll take a look at that generator number later in Delco parts book and see what it shows? Your generator may have been a later replacement or we may not have number right yet. Other Delco generators I remember that had 3 terminals were so they could be setup and wired as replacement generators for either "A" circuit and "B" circuit generators. Those were kind of universal replacement generators. It could just be one of those? Then you would still just use two terminals but I would have to look at it more or see what the Delco book showed on which terminals to use. It depends on if the field is grounded externally or internally. JD Delco should be a B circuit type. Might just pay to take it by your local electric repair shop and let them look at it. That way you can also get the armature tested for shorts in a growler and more thorough test on field coils. Then if you find out something is wrong with it can start looking for another generator or decide to repair the one you have.

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jac

05-13-2006 17:43:36




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to Glen in TX, 05-13-2006 16:00:11  
Checked this thing out a little more. I think Glen has the model number correct. The third terminal is labeled "RET". Rectifier???

Found the "F" label but the last terminal is not labeled. Must be the "A" terminal.



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jac

05-13-2006 16:16:36




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to Glen in TX, 05-13-2006 16:00:11  
Glen: Thanks for the information



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Glen in TX

05-13-2006 12:50:35




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 06:49:37  
That should be a Delco Remy 1102102 generator on the 440 I and IC and ICD originally. It is 12 volt and the system was orginally set up as positive ground. According to the JD electrical manual SM2029 Electrical service manual wiring diagram for JD 440 it only shows a generator with 2 posts A & F. Did you mean the regulator has 3 posts? The manual I have only shows 6 or 12V setups for the 440 unless some later ones were different? Email me if you need a wiring diagram later. Also the SM2029 is available from JD publications at 800-522-7448 or http://techpubs.deere.com and 440 manuals are available from JD industrial publications at 866-213-3373 or link below.

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jac

05-13-2006 06:51:44




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 06:49:37  
One last comment, engine is out of the crawler so this needs to be a bench test



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Bob

05-13-2006 09:57:49




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-13-2006 06:51:44  
I am not familiar with that MACHINE, but the extra terminal sometimes means it's a 24-Volt system. I don't know if that is a possibility on your machine. Do you know the system voltage?

If it is only 12-Volt, and it's a Delco generator, connecting the "F" (field) terminal to the frame of the generator (called "full-fielding"), then running it, should make it charge at it's max ouput. (Don't run it that way too long, as it will be overloaded, and overheat.)

Also, with it "on the bench" (no belt installed), it should "motor" when battery (+) is jumpered to "A", and battery (-) is connected to generator frame. This will also "polarize" the generator.

Verifying the voltage regulator works is another matter, and, it the system IS 24-Volt, it gets more complicated, too.

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Bob

05-13-2006 13:42:40




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to Bob, 05-13-2006 09:57:49  
Since GlenTX has verified it IS 12-Volts, and POSITIVE GROUND, reverse the jumper wire connections I posted!



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jac

05-14-2006 13:08:35




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to Bob, 05-13-2006 13:42:40  
Figured it out. Third terminal is the "Return" which goes to the case ground. Wired it to the case and then jumped the generator and it appears to work. Took it apart and cleaned it up a bit. Will give it a try when I get the engine back in.



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Glen in TX

05-15-2006 10:30:07




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-14-2006 13:08:35  
jac, Yes it is a return terminal like you found out. The Delco parts sheet for that generator number didn't even show a third terminal but it shows that type in Delco Remy repair manual service bulletin 1G-150. It has a F, A1 and A2 terminals with each A terminal being connected to a brush yet A1 is also connected to other opposing field coil. It is called a "insulated" generator circuit and uses a wire return from the battery and other accessories in place of using the vehicle frame and engine block as the return circuit. Hopefully it will work okay later and put out 12-14 volts to battery when checking with a voltmeter at half to full throttle speed.

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jac

05-16-2006 19:28:46




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to Glen in TX, 05-15-2006 10:30:07  
Glen: Thanks for all your help. I bench tested the generator under a Full Field condition and running it with a 1/3 hp electric motor, it was putting out around 12 volts. Actually needed a little larger motor once I full fielded the generator since the 1/3 hp motor could not really run it very fast. I think it is working fine. Just need to put a new clutch in this crawler, re-install the engine and this 1959 JD 440ICD will be running again! My first crawler restoration. Good winter project but rough is the check book.

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Glen in TX

05-16-2006 21:23:06




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 Re: Delco-Remy Generator in reply to jac, 05-16-2006 19:28:46  
Ok, sounds like it's probably going to work for you but if you still need a wiring diagram email me later. Have fun with it. I don't know if the folks at this link have a clutch for your 440 but they have some others for JD for less $$.



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