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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value

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ld5030

08-27-2006 01:30:37




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10 years back I plant a row of trees along what I believed to be my property line. Used the utility poles (put in when I had the house built) as a reference. They ran perpendicular to the road, but the property line, come to find out, does not. It tapers in. Recently the neighbor who owned the land, along where the trees are, sold off the back portion of his property to another party. The new owners tell me my trees are on their property. (I already knew this a from my other neighbor"s survey when he built several years back.) They ask me if I want to buy some of the land to clear up the issue of the trees. I say yes and they offer several options from just enough to get the trees (1/4 acre) up to 1 acre. The length of the property line is 600+ ft. Township super tells them land goes for 4-5K/acre which is what they are basing there asking price on. That figure may be about right, but I think that would assume decent ground that would be buildable. This is landlocked with no road frontage of which 1/3 is a low spot which currently has standing water and the some of the rest of the topsoil has been disturbed when the land was cleared of brush when it was purchased. Should the value of the described land be discounted? Opinions please. Thanks,jim

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JK-NY

08-28-2006 18:52:29




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
If you want it you should be willing to give them the going rate or close to it.They dont have to sell it, they are doing you a favor. If you arent worried about not owning the trees and not willing to pay thier price then maybe you can find where the line really is and plant more trees. Not sure what state you're in but you might want to check local requirements for subdividing a parcel. I had a neighbor who borders my farm down the road want to buy a strip like you describe and offered me a low "per acre " based price. I told him what I'd take and he agreed, i told him he had to stand all the subdividing cost since this was being done for his benifit. The cost of a requiredsurvey and subdivision fee that the town required was more than he intended to pay for the land so that ended that.

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John (C-IL)

08-27-2006 11:48:34




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
This issue is not about the market value of the land. The issue is wether you want the land you planted trees on or not. You are talking about $1250 to $1500 to have what you want. This seems pretty reasonable.



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Matt from CT

08-27-2006 11:02:06




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
If you want to control the trees, pay them what their asking. It was your mistake.

If you don't care about controlling the trees, don't.

===== ===== ===== ====
Auto dealership in town, as long as I can remember (I'm 36).

Few years back, a new gas station went in next door.

Apparantley when the company that owns the gas station did the survey, they discovered a "problem" and couldn't come to a resolution with the dealership --

Dealership's lot went straight back from the road...

Today there's a fence that starts at the corner by the road...and ends up a good 100' closer to the dealership by the back of the lot.

Gas station doesn't use that area at all. Reduced the dealer's lot size by about a 1/5th though.

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Alberta Mike

08-27-2006 17:45:18




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to Matt from CT, 08-27-2006 11:02:06  
So it would just be the immigrants that would do that (like my grandfather and yours probably)? I think some of the locals who've been around for generations might do some of those same things from what I've seen. Do you ever get the feeling that you prejudge people based on things you don't know a lot about?



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pcy1066

08-27-2006 07:40:51




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
pay the man someone will buy it for spite put in a school bus and a camper full of imagrants that will chop down your trees for cooking wood, shoot your dog rape your cat steal your gas, then sell it to yopu for twice the money, at which time you will gladly pay



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jdemaris

08-27-2006 07:55:32




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to pcy1066, 08-27-2006 07:40:51  
You make a good point. There was an odd-ball 1/2 acre plot of almost useless land close to our house. Market value was probably no more than $1000. Seems whoever owned our farm at one time had broken it off. We searched and found out the owner was in State prison serving 30 years. We wound up buying it for $6000 - and that really p*ssed me off. But, what are you going to do? Prisoner or not, he owned it, we wanted to keep anyone from sticking a trailer on it, so we paid the price.

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pcy1066

08-27-2006 11:02:21




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to jdemaris, 08-27-2006 07:55:32  
we are the third farm at the end of a dead end twp road our neighbor farm got bought by realitors about 15 years ago, a 400 acre farm devided up into 5 acre tracts, the 5 acres next to my garadge i give 12000 for then,we have had unreal amounts of land owners next to us since, school buses campers, shacks, hubdreds of junk cars,if it aint nailed down when you leave it will b gone when you come back, the locale law is on this farm at least once a day, drugies, whores,theives,are some of the better neighbors i only wish i would have bought 2 more tracts when they were 12000 at that time it was unhearsd of, 500 -1200 a acre was high then .right now a track thats hillside multyflooreroses is for sale the realitor is asking 25000 and will probly get it

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jdemaris

08-27-2006 07:39:11




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Seems the key issue is . . . the owner can ask any price he wants - regardless of what land values tend to be. I had a somewhat similar experience on my land. There is town road that comes through my farm. The Town came through a few years back and widened the road by 15' and removed over 50 small and mature hard maple trees. Me and my family had been away for two weeks - and I was kind of shocked when we came home. I confronted the Town Highway Supervisor and Mayor (called a Town Supervisor here). They said it was a town road with a 50 foot right-of-way width. I informed them they were wrong and gave them some legal paperwork on Public Highway Law. They gave it to the Town Attorney - and he discovered I was correct, and they were in error. So, to cover their mistake - the Town decided to take my land by Eminent Domain. That's where the pricing issue came into play. Land in my area can vary from $500 to $5000 per acre. All depends how large the plot, type of access and grade, buildable or not, etc. The Town proposed taking a 20' wide strip of land that runs through my land. They came up with a value of $300 per acre - that - because none of the land is buildable with such a narrow strip. They also came up with a value for the smaller - approx. 8" diam. Maple trees or $30 each. My figuring was quite different. First - I did not want to sell the land. Second - in my opinion, widening the road made the rest of my land worth less to me - since it would change the character of what was a rural, single lane, seasonal, dirt country road, to a wide, paved, highway with increased traffic. To me, the land was worth - at the least - the area-high of $5000 per acre. Also, in regard to the 8" diameter trees they cut down illegally. Yes, timber or firewood value was close to zero. But - what about replacement value? Suppose I wanted my trees back, as they were? Got a price from a professional tree transplanter of $3000 per tree. So, the fight went on and on - and perhaps is still on going. We had a public hearing - because the residents are required to vote on Eminent Domain issues. For the most part, local people had no concern about my land being taken, but WERE upset if it could ever happen to them. The Town dropped the issue (as far as I know), they paid me nothing, and I put fill back where they removed it and replanted trees on my own. I did make the Town bring me back all the wood - since most of it had been taken home, by town workers, for firewood - for their own use. I also found a part of State Public Highway law - from the 1800s but still valid - that says if - a town ever puts a highway through farmland - they are required to construct and maintain animal fence along both sides of the road - if requested by the owner - that owner being me. I was tempted to make them do it - just for spite. But, the reality is - I just wanted to be left alone. My mindset now? I wouldn't sell it to the town for $10,000 per acre.

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T_Bone

08-27-2006 06:32:32




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Hi Jim,

Lets see, a 600ft long x 18ft wide would be about 1/4acre.

So for about $2000 the new neighbor can have the trees removed and "bill you for there removal" since you infringed on his property rights without premission.

Sounds like your neighbor is pretty nice to someone that can't judge 18ft by eye!

T_Bone



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Dachshund

08-27-2006 06:07:27




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Depending on where you live, some of those "correction" acres are pretty expensive. It doesn't really matter where the land is OR the condition, on such a small section. It's not really landlocked - the access comes from either his land or your land - the piece is not being sold to be it's own entity - it will be absorbed into your property, or remain in his. If there were MORE property involved (10-12 acres) THEN the price would drop, Pay him for enough to cover the SPREAD of the trees (no branches over the line) plus 10 feet, and get the issue resolved.

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MMB

08-27-2006 05:16:17




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
I don't know the size of the properties that you and your neighbor are living on but if it were anything substantial and he was being stubborn or trying to stick it to you for a land price, I'd just tell him he can have the trees for himself. Is it really going to make any difference to you who owns the trees or the property that they are growing on? Would he cut them down if he owned them or leave them? I would guess you could bluff him through the whole deal, but that's jsut my 2 cents, I can see the advantage of having the thing settled.

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djw

08-27-2006 05:05:16




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Land around here wirh road frontage sells between $2000-$5000 an acre. Backlands with no acess go for around $500 per acre. Last year I bought 2 acres of my neigbors property and while trying to decide value, we asked the town tax assesor, $500 per acre
Goodluck Dave



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Oliver in SC

08-27-2006 03:00:37




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Yes, it should be discounted. However, this will be a private issue between you and the seller. Wetlands, as you described as being 1/3 of the area in discussion, is protected by Federal and possibly local law. Whether you consider this to be a good thing or a bad thing, you are supposed to obtain a permit to disturb wetlands. Soooo, the actual value to you will determine the price.



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TimsRV in Battle Ground W

08-27-2006 02:48:47




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to ld5030, 08-27-2006 01:30:37  
Doesn't sound like that land is worth much to anybody except maybe you. I guess how much you should offer them would depend on how much you really want it. I'm guessing they'll let it go for less than that 5k per acre figure. Personally I wouldn't offer more than $2,500 for the whole acre. If you want less, I'd keep it to that same ratio or less..... but that's just me. If it's of no real value to them, I'm guessing they'll go for it. Good luck. Tim

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Bill of TN

08-27-2006 15:27:53




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 Re: OT: Seeking opinions on Land Value in reply to TimsRV in Battle Ground W, 08-27-2006 02:48:47  
I think your new neighbor is being very nice to offer you the chance.

You might ask him if they will reduce the price a bit....nothing wrong with haggling if done right.....that said, if he won't move then you'll have to make a choice to buy at his price.

If it were me, and I wanted the land, I'd buy it as you may not get a chance to buy the land in the future.



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