To Nebraska Cowman

Also, you've been including a link in every post to your own personal message board and/or your business web site. Please discontinue this also. Mentioning ones own website or business now and again is fine, but self promotion or advertising of a personal site or business on a regular basis is not permitted.

In addition to the issues I've just mentioned, we've had complaints from others who are concerned about viewing a photo of a child sticking a knife in an electric socket every time they view a forum thread you've responded to.

We wish you the best with your business and your forum, but please do not use our forums promote them.

Thank you,
Kim

Mahalo,
doogdoog

Rexalot's post:
Jim:
"I think as a parent, if your child is using the computer to browse websites, you have the responsibility to check on what they are doing and the sites they visit. We are NOT here to raise your kids."

"If Jim is going to let his kids or grandkids view this site, then it"s HIS responbility to educate them on what is right and wrong and what they see here. The photo in itself isn"t as much offensive or disturbing from what can be seen in National Geographic or in any magazine or newspaper. Turn on the TV, Jim. Maybe you haven"t seen the news lately either. You"ve agreed to the TOS Jim or you wouldn"t be posting here."

Jim, I have a 7 year old daughter(Youngest of 6 children) and it is MY JOB to control what she views and hears, not the SYSTEM. I have the "on/off" button, remote control. AND "I know where my children are tonite."

Keith & Shawn

Shawn (my Special Olympic's boy) & Sheana on their tractor

The result of this situation has certainly irked a few people on both sides, and with that in mind, I recall a similar situation, over different issues, but having a very similar effect. ACMOC & ACME boards, used to be on one somewhat troublesome board, but it was one place where the people who enjoyed the old caterpillar iron got together. It was really invaluable to many many people who to their benefit, got great advice and leads to resources, from some absolutely great and talented people, some of who had massive libraries of literature and years of experience, that would also lend a hand to someone who needed help in the hobby. It ended up being divided, not adversarial either, but divided and people kind of chose sides, so if you wanted a particular persons attention or help or vice-versa, you now have 2 sites to deal with instead of one.

I always thought the reason sites like this were so great, was because people made them so great and that they stuck together, through thick & thin. What happened here had a resounding effect and you know what, no matter who is right or who is wrong, losing people no matter what their opinion is about something is a bad thing.

Relative to the issue at hand, I think one far outweighs the other here, cause and effect that is, and that is all I can say to a great site and a great bunch of people whom I've valued the knowlege and opinion of for quite some time.

Now if Kim wanted to say any and all links; pictures; used as a Avatar in every post is not allowed; that is her right. Even though it was voted on in a post by Cowman; Kim might have missed that post and she does have the final vote.
I can also see where linking to another tractor discussion board would not be allowed.

If you think Kim should have handled this in private; you have to consider that something like this would have got out anyway. The fact that she choose to do it on the main forum shows she is not afraid of the flack she knew it would stir up and is willing to face down anyone to protect her site in anyway she feels fit.

So Kim I respect you for making a business decision and sticking with it even though others may not agree with your decision.

I continue to come here for the sound advice, even with the ANTIQUATED forum software.

Now the moderator/owner takes the weak way to deal with an issue rather than the "country boy" way and deal with it face to face.

Don't know what I will do, but I won't go out of my way to offer information on YTmag from now on.

Jim

Don't take it seriously until Kim responds. Does anyone know her real IP address?

Just for ther record, I support Kim. It took a lot of courage to lay down the law for all to see, and take the heat for it. She did not attack or condemn Cowman for what he is doing, and neither do I. It's simply the rules.
And I sincerely hope that Cowman sticks around and helps us folks that get along better with the old forum software than the new one. We really appreciate your advice and presence around here.

That's how I see it, for what it's worth.

I make donations to the site in order to help secure it's future, but you can bet your sweet bippie that I won't buy any products from here! I refuse to do business with people that are this petty. I don't see anything wrong with what the Cowman was doing. There are plenty of other sites on the net that list this site in their links. Maybe they should end that practice since Kim may actually benefit from the use of their webspace!

Jim Johnson - please grow up and find better things to do with your time.

Kim - Send Howard an email if possible and don't chase off the people that make your site work. Without them you won't have anything!

Funny thing is I never knew the picture was the link to his site until it was mentioned in this post. Heck I just thought it was a photo....

Yea this probably should have been handles more privatly but even if it had been someone would have heard about it and started a discussion and we would be right were we are now.

Hang around Nebraska Cowman, we all enjoy reading your posts.

Kim, you do a great job of running this site and i really appreciate it. I learn alot from here.

Concerning the picture, well its comedic relief. Heck I watched a kid in grade school show me how to do that with paper clips in the 2nd grade. I never did it, but still its humorous.

Christos

P.S. Kim, I love your site but at times like this I dont envy the position your in, at least theres always someone around to second guess your choices...lol

I can see merit in what you say about the Cowman posting about his sight. I do not agree about his picture, I think its funny. My 5 yr old daughter has seen it several times and has yet to put a butter knife in an electrical outlet.

I like this sight, and the generally clean atmosphere; however these issues should have been dealt with in a private conversation.

Rob

And while I am at it, I am really getting tired of this nation of tattletales. If you are one, consider this a virtual punch in your big fat mouth. Jim...grow a pair.

Having said that he has also been around here long enough to know the rules on commercial advertising. I agree that he broke those rules, and you have every right to deal with this as you see fit. I support your stand.

Can Kim or someone please explain something
to me? How can Nebraska Cowman's postings be a problem
when there is someone on the Deere site who
consistently breaks all the rules regarding
this- "Mentioning one's own website or business
now and again is fine, but self promotion of a
personal site or business on a regular basis is
not permitted"
This occurs on the Deere site nearly every day,
usually several times daily.
Why the double standard? Thank you, CalJim

I think what I'm going to have to get used to is that YT has gone from being a small informal web site, to being a big business.

For you Mr.Johnson, I offer this, Under paragraph 6. Member Conduct:

"You understand that by using the Service, you may be exposed to Content that is offensive, indecent or objectionable."

Of Course there is the following as well:

"YT is concerned about the safety and privacy of all its users, particularly children." And, "b. harm minors in any way;"

So, I guess there is something in the TOS to cover both sides of the argument.

Now, I think as a parent, if your child is using the computer to browse websites, you have the responsibility to check on what they are doing and the sites they visit. We are NOT here to raise your kids.

If Jim is going to let his kids or grandkids view this site, then it"s HIS responbility to educate them on what is right and wrong and what they see here. The photo in itself isn"t as much offensive or disturbing from what can be seen in National Geographic or in any magazine or newspaper. Turn on the TV, Jim. Maybe you haven"t seen the news lately either. You"ve agreed to the TOS Jim or you wouldn"t be posting here.

As for his picture being a link to his own site, I didn"t know that before today.

In reading the TOS I didn"t find any section that limits or prevents the making of picture post"s in the forums. The only problem I see with posting pictures in the forums is for user"s with limited internet connectivity. Might take a long time to download. The viewer of this forum may need a choice.

I also didn"t find anything that prevents a user from inserting "links" in a post. In fact, YT mag has paragraph just to explain "Links".

I visited Cowmans website. While I agree that it is of similiar content I don"t see where he is infringing on any rights of this site. I think he should if he doesn"t already provide a link to here. Free advertising. Win - Win? Ofcourse, Kim has a right to prevent use of this website for any reason, including the right to remove content. It"s in the TOS. She could"ve kicked Cowman to the curb without explanation.

Cowman, I suggest you post your picts where asked, in the photo album and just put a link in your post. What really happens is those that have slow internet can choose to view or not.

Could this have been handled privately, yes. Should it have been, probably. Instead an example has been made that only a few of the users of this site will take note of (and Jim is happy now.)

Enough Politics. This is a tractor website.

To bad we can"t get this post "locked". Lets make this the last word.

Kim owns the server, so she can choose who gets to play here and what they say. Since she owns the press, her desires can set the limits. I may not like it but thats too bad. Thats why I bought my own server and pay to keep it warm and happy. I run my website and forums from there, even host a few people for free, on the condition that there is NO censorship except as required by US law.

I think its an artistic image that anyone old enough to be on here should benefit from. If nothing else to remind us to 1. watch our kids when they are online for there is far worse images to get to much easier. 2. watch our kids around the house. Everytime I saw it, it made me think where is mine and what is he doing.

If thats the worst my grandkids are going to see is that picture,my grandkids will grow up just fine.

With all the stuff they can see on the TV and video games that they normally would view this is nothing.

If they are old enough to read these forums they know better than to stick the knife in the sockett.

Gary

Just don't know what to say to this.

Howard certainly is gracious about it all.

Howard we think the world of you, and I think you know that. Harley