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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Digging a level trench with a backhoe

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Terry Edwards

01-09-2007 09:31:05




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Hi guys,
Going to install a leachbed septic system this coming spring. Have rented a backhoe in the past to use around the farm, but this project will require me to dig eight (8) 100 foot long trenches about 24 inches deep with slope of 1/2 inch per 10 feet. How does a person go about getting the trench that close to level with the backhoe bucket....it is just practice, practice, practice, or will I end up using a shovel and gravel for placement?
Thanks for the tips!

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buickanddeere

01-09-2007 20:17:56




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Around here besides trenching, the regs often call for raised bed systems. My system has to evaporate up. The clay bottom may as well be concrete.



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thejdman01

01-09-2007 16:37:25




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Rent a lazer with the backhoe, lazer shoudl be chaeap compared to a shovel and gravel, but any decent rental yard should have a trencher on hand. Around here anything 60" depth or below can be found at ANY yard, quite a few like the vermeers have a backhoe/backfill blade on one end and the trencher on the other and only rent slight more then straight backhoe, if you were hoping to do some other jobs w/the backhoe end do it all at once.

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jim in N M

01-09-2007 14:54:08




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Vary interesting subject. I did my filter bed seven yrs. ago, I used something new at that time called "Infilterators" about six ft. long,three ft.wide and about two ft. high, kind of like a quonsit hut look. Each one snapped on to the other one and for a 2800sq. ft. house required eighty ft. total. so I put in two fifty ft. runs. and they MUST be put in level and no gravel required. her in New Mexico every body uses them,not by code but it's quicker and now gravel to mess with. these Infilterators are made I believe in New york state,but almost every sypply house has them. sorry for being windy. Jim in N M

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Roy Suomi

01-09-2007 14:46:51




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
We use washed bank gravel as bedding and pipe cover [ usually 57 or 67 sized]. Then sand within 6 inches from surface of grade ..A layer of straw to keep backfill soil from permeating sand.. Theory is the sand wicks moisture to the soil level and evaporates water away..



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city farmer

01-09-2007 14:24:58




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
don"t know about up north but if florida we do not use any rock or gravel havent for a long time many ways to run drain feilds today every thing out of plastic works great check with health dept in your area they are the ones that regulate these as far as digging a level ditch with fall 4 level on top of a 8" 2x4 you can get levels with 1/8"" fall built into the levels empire levels sells these

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Larry806

01-09-2007 12:35:45




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Just did one here in Ohio. digging the laterals isn"t exact . Here we dig 9 inches deeper than the tile goes. than after digging the laterals every 10 ft dump a small pile of stone ( 57"s) use the laser to get grade. Set the drain tile ( 10 ft sections) on the stone pillars. Than carefully & slowly , so you don"t break grade fill the trench to the top of the tile with stone. My son a neighbor & I did 600 ft in 4 hours

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Walt Davies

01-09-2007 12:32:41




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Out here they have a new system for ground that won't percolate.
They smooth out the ground then lay this funny looking plastic stuff that is open on the bottom then cover with 18 inches of dirt. It percolates up not down.
You would think it would smell bad but it doesn't.
They put on my neighbors place and it does work.

We were alway wondering why his low place was so wet even in the dry summer. Then last summer he was digging a pit with the backhoe and about 5 to 6 feet down hit a solid layer of Black slate.
Walt

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Tim, Ohio

01-09-2007 12:21:32




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Not sure if you know what you are doing or not, but
we did a leach field recently. The design we used was a continuous trench that went about 40 feet before it was u-turned and came back along the ditch that had been just dug. When we came
back to the the beginning end of the first ditch
with the second it was u-turned again. This was
repeated until the combined length equaled what
was required for the size of the household. Each
successive ditch was a little lower than the previous one. At the end of each ditch in the u-turn bend a mound was left about a foot high in the ditch. So, as the water from the septic
tank entered the first ditch it would fill up until it reached the top of the mound at the first
u-turn. This slowed the water so it would have
time to leach into the ground. As the level
in the first ditch rises it eventually overcomes
the hump at the first u-turn, then slowly overflows into the next ditch. The second ditch
is lower than the first and so on. All ditches
were filled with 1" or larger river rock (round
agregate) with black flex tile having holes, not
slits in the tile. The top of the gravel was covered with landscape fabric and then backfilled
with dirt to grade.

Tim, Ohio

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Leland

01-09-2007 12:00:30




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Lots of practice and having a ditch bucket helps a lot to leaves the bottom nice and smooth and clean ,unless you have a lot of roots and rocks



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Larry NE IL

01-09-2007 11:44:16




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
When you rent the backhoe, rent a surveyers level, or a laser level. The best way when you are new is to figure what elevation you want to be at, then shoot the ground at the surface. That will tell you how much to dig. The reach on the backhoe should be about 12'. Put a paint mark on the ground every 10' and thats where you will have to be 1/2" deeper.
Keep the bucket with the teeth down. The 3"-4" of loose dirt from the teeth wil make any hand work required easy. Bulk the dirt out until under 1' to go, then pull crowd lever toward you while regulating the depth with dipper lever. The tendancy of most is to grade uphill as you work toward the tractor. As you dig the trench, always try to dig a level grade. Good practice for when you get to the bottom.
Take your time and enjoy....did it for many years.

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Mike M

01-09-2007 11:24:09




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
I didn't have too much trouble keeping it level. You'll get the hang of it. My dad was in the trench running the level. Do some and go on then do some more. On some of the Deere hoe's if you pull back both levers at the same time they go level too.



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Mike M

01-09-2007 11:23:12




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
I didn't have too much trouble keeping it level. You'll get the hang of it. My dad was in the trench running the level. Do some and go on then do some more.



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Dave2N

01-09-2007 11:20:47




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
I'm not a backhoe operator but I've watched a lot of operators. I think it's experience. But I'll say straight out that I have nothing but the utmost respect for a skilled backhoe operator. It's amazing what these guys (and gals) can do.



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Gerald J.

01-09-2007 11:13:48




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
I took tape and masked off mark places for each depth of dig on the dipper stick. That helps me keep the depth constant.

But in this county the last I checked it wasn't allowed to dig a drain field ditch with a back hoe because the smeared dirt on the bottom won't take water good. The last 6" has to be dug with a square ended hand shoved pushed only straight down. That's to not smear the surface that is left.

Gerald J.

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the tractor vet

01-09-2007 10:40:16




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Experiance comes to mind but now today they have LASERS that either will limit your digging depth or will have a box with a red a green and a yellow that will lite up as to where your at and works off the laser . Back when i was running equiment we did not have all that fancy stuff and one guy ran the machine one guy ran the mexican dragline and stick and one guy did the GOFER STUFF and ran the transit or we would set up a string line and use a stick and a lock level .

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mjbrown

01-09-2007 10:34:32




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Practice AND shovel. I use a 4' level and run it along the bottom of the ditch and fine tune with a round point shovel. There is gravelless soil pipe on the market now that is perferated corrigated plastic in fine mesh cloth. It has worked for us well so far.



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Maark

01-09-2007 10:31:50




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
I think you need to check with your county engineer or the appropriate official at the court house. Septic systems codes have changed. The ground my need to be tested for perculation and then inspected after the new system has been installed per code.



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old

01-09-2007 10:25:11




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Pratice, pratice and more yep. Now then you really need to dig it about a foot deeper then that, fill with some gravel, lay the pipe, fill with more gravel, then lay plastic on top of the gravel. The plastic keeps the fill dirt from blending into the gravel and clogging things up. Also if you want and even better system at the end of each line make a dry well. Dig a hole 8-10 foot deep run the end on the line into it and fill 3/4 of the way with gravel, then cover with plastic and then fill in the rest with dirt. Thats how e did my system and my parents system and we have never had any problem and both system where done back before 1992

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Matt Smith

01-09-2007 10:12:03




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Are you certain that the codes department will let you dig your own septic field?

BTW, gravel is the correct answer.



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big jt

01-09-2007 11:08:25




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Matt Smith, 01-09-2007 10:12:03  
In Iowa there would be no problem with putting in your own. Just need to have the permits and have it inspected.

thing that seems odd to me is having slope. When we had one put in the leach field needed to be dead flat. If memory serves no gravel allowed. I made a straight blade for the digger's bucket.

We hired the digging done as when I have tried to make a level trench with a backhoe it was a abject disaster. would guess with practice I could do it but sometimes it is easier to hire some things done.

If memory serves the backhoe labor was a small portion of the cost. All the plumbing bits were what cost the big bucks. We needed to put in a tank (Main reason) Lift pump, and bed. bout $6000 for 3 bath, 3 bedroom house.

jt

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Darrell Wilson

01-09-2007 10:06:29




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
We always used a transit



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Jd4840

01-09-2007 09:47:23




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Terry Edwards, 01-09-2007 09:31:05  
Dig it deeper than needed with the slope going in the right direction. Then add gravel to fine tune the slope. Gravel will be needed anyway to provide for an adequate amount of drainage area. You will also need to cover the tile with gravel after they are laid out.



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davpal

01-09-2007 09:53:10




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 Re: Digging a level trench with a backhoe in reply to Jd4840, 01-09-2007 09:47:23  
Exactly what I was thinking. Don't you use peastone for the drainage material in the trench?



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