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Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down.

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Cummins/Cat

04-09-2007 21:16:50

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I finally just got rid of my 9400 John Deere 4wd today. THE WORST tractor we have ever owned. I have owned a large number of Johns over the years and never once was i impressed with the engines. they all seem so bagged out and gutless. I had a 1155 Versatile 4wd with the KT cummins in it before dad had a brain wave and decided to buy a brand new 9400. That old Cummins had twice the snort as the John had, and it had 10500 hours on it. It just seems everytime you lug a john deere diesel down, it doesn't have the staying power a Cat or Cummins has.... anybody else agree?

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MLD

04-11-2007 08:53:01

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

You didn't mention anything about durability??? I would base the worst I've ever owned on an overall scale, not just because it lacked alittle power.

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buickanddeere

04-10-2007 14:39:10

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

Hey junior, what else did your daddy say about tractors while he was drunked up.

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Walt Davies

04-10-2007 12:05:15

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

a lot of old Stiegers around here still working the big fields. A few JDs but not the really big ones. Cat with there new rubber tracs are making a come back also. But that big IH CASE 450 with quad trac now that's something else. I watched it pull an entire train of stuff behind last summer Talk about going once over to plow disc and harrow a field.
Walt

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No tools

04-10-2007 08:45:03

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

The problem lies here.
D8K vs D8h.- Straight pipe the D8k.- with a terex 72-51 with d8 parts on a IH 412 scraper traded for a d8 pulling 24 bottom plow over 12000 acres followed up by a straight pipe D8k.Cut back to a 3700 jd 12 bottom.now we lost enterest in buying the D8K Or the D8H.

Cummins cat is the way to go

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Steven@AZ

04-10-2007 06:46:00

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

You are not making a fair comparison... The 9400 JD is rated at 425 horsepower engine and 371 drawbar horsepower, while the 1155 Versatile is rated 470 engine horsepower and 400 horsepower on the drawbar.

Don't compare apples to oranges and then come and complain when the oranges taste like a citrus fruit!

I've been an IH guy my entire life and we recently purchased an 8630 to pull the air seeder... I'm ready to trade everything in on a JD with a quad range transmission!

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:12:11

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Steven@AZ, 04-10-2007 06:46:00

Steven, the old Cummins was lugged down with dual Trelleborg's and on soft ground trying to pull a giant elm tree stump out, she would make those tires spin. The John deere on the other hand had your basic radials with standard tread and it would kick the transmission out 9 times outta 10 before it would spin the tires, I am just not impressed with the john deere tractors at all, there are alot better tractors availiable out there with REAL engines in them. Not some bagged out farmer special. all people are buying when they buy JD is the paint.

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Steven@AZ

04-10-2007 07:17:38

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-10-2007 07:12:11

I am going to agree with you on the JD engines lacking the lugging power of other makes - they are smaller cubic inches and the ones that I've looked into have a shorter stroke as well, resulting in less lower RPM lugging ability. I feel that our JD is matched nicely with the equipment we use and we try to avoid lugging situations.

My positive experience with JD has to do with a very nice cab (this on our 8630) compared to other makes, better parts availability (has to do with problems with local CNH dealer, while JD dealer always is friendly and has parts on hand), better resale value, and I am thoroughly impressed with the ease of use of the quad range transmission.

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:25:01

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Steven@AZ, 04-10-2007 07:17:38

Its just that up here, we are still breaking virgin priarie and need the horsepower to pull rome plows and our big 12 bottom in the hard clay ground, need the lugging power.

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Mike M

04-10-2007 09:48:33

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-10-2007 07:25:01

Get you an old steam engine and it may out pull them all ! Cheaper fuel too !

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Allan In NE

04-10-2007 06:19:25

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

You need to talk to your Dad. I'm sure he has his reasons for buying what he does.

Allan

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:15:57

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Allan In NE, 04-10-2007 06:19:25

Ya he had his reasons, he was a senile old man and was starting to loose his marbles. He passed away this winter so the first thing i did was get rid of that dog nut John deere and went and bought my 1155 back from the nieghbors.

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Bob

04-10-2007 07:40:55

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-10-2007 07:15:57

1.) Have some respect for your late father.

2.) Stop acting like a "troll".

Yeah, I know, "who died and left me in charge here", but SOMEBODY had to say it!

That being said, I was never close to my Dad while growing up, and looked after him for MANY years while he suffered the ravages of aging and Alzheimers. He was MEAN and ornery to my Mom and myself, yet there is not a day that passes that I do not think of him and miss him.

Perhaps some day you will find peace and some respect for your departed Dad!

For what it's worth... Internet "troll" definition:

"In Internet terminology, a troll is someone who intentionally posts derogatory or otherwise inflammatory messages about sensitive topics in an established online community such as an online discussion forum to bait users into responding."

Troll definition source

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Brian G. NY

04-10-2007 16:15:36

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 07:40:55

Bob, I'm an old man myself and when I was young I thought at times I hated the 'ol man because he worked my arse off when I was a teenager. However, as time passed, I came to find out that I learned a great deal fom him in spite of myself. One of my favorite sayings goes something like this: "When I was sixteen I could not believe how little my father knew; by the time I had reached twenty-one, I couldn't believe how much he'd learned in such a short time."

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Bob

04-10-2007 17:13:26

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Brian G. NY, 04-10-2007 16:15:36

Amen, Brian!

By the time my Dad and Uncle passed away a few years ago, I had two exceptionally smart (just ask them) teenage boys who are now 17 and 19.

So I more or less went from "being the smart kid" to having a couple of "smart kids" of my own.

Just today, I sat with the 17 y-o while he tried to explain to the Juvenile Court Officer how smart he and a bunch of his friends are. She wasn't "buying" it, either! Strange how life works, isn't it!

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The Dukester

04-11-2007 13:48:41

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 17:13:26

You could probably find someone to turn the old Sleepy John Deere up so it would have snarling power and pollute the daylights out of the air around it. Did you ever notice all the black smoke that comes out of most high powered diesels when they are pulled hard...what do you think that is?? Someday someone with a "Dudley Doo Right Desire" is gonna start taking pictures of dirty high powered diesels and raising h--l about it and that will eventually bring an end to tractor pulling, antique tractor shows and high powered dirty diesel engines. Run the living h--l out of your Massey.....while you can.

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:56:17

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 07:40:55

Hey Bob my dad and i farmed together for 40 years, and never once did we have much of a fight, except the day he came rolling into the yard with that 9400 without even consulting me at all. And i don't really care what your father did to you after the sun went down around your house, so spare me your preachin will ya?

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Bob

04-10-2007 09:23:32

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Family farm relationships.... Comments wanted... in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-10-2007 07:56:17

No preaching here.

But why do you throw out a scenario for the world to comment on and then be so snotty about taking a minute to listen to and empathize with a somewhat similar situation someone else has lived through?

I'll quote your statement: "And i don't really care what your father did to you after the sun went down around your house, so spare me your preachin will ya?"

Not much empathy there! You REALLY do come across as a "troll" and a jerk to boot! Notice I said "come across"... all we know of you is in this "thread" and we all know it's risky to make any assumptions of folk's character by what is posted anonymously on the 'net.

I REALLY hope you are just having a bad day, and that comment was "out of charcater for you", and that you someday find peace with your Dad's memory.

From the tone of your posts it seems you have yet to find that peace, and I suspect the tractor issue may be a coverup for other resentment you have of other "issues" of farming with your Dad.

I LOVE farming and the chance to grow up on the farm. However, it's REALLY sad how many family farm relationships (my own included) end up with anger within the family over who is the manager (boss) of the operation... in charge of the checkbook.

If you farmed with your Dad for 40 years, and had no say in the operation, that's sad. I know. I had a similar experience with my Uncle, although not for quite so many years... he was "good as gold" to me, but was "going to live forever" and had NO interest in an orderly transition of my taking over the farm.

When he suddenly had a stroke and wound up in a rest home with no long term care insurance, it nearly cost me the farm (which was LONG before willed to me) and all the "sweat equity" I had in it. Thankfully, I was able to hang on to most of it although I no longer farm it myself.

I'll close by saying the ones of us who grew up farm kids, and stuck around hoping to take over the farm someday from relatives unwilling to set up the orderly transition of management are DAMNED FOOLS... myself included!

Comments by others who have gone through the "family farm thing"????

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dad's88

04-11-2007 17:31:47

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Re: Family farm relationships.... Comments wanted. in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 09:23:32

Bob, that was a very THOUGHTFUL response to a person that obviously has an axe to grind.

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4010guy

04-10-2007 12:03:30

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Re: Family farm relationships.... Comments wanted. in reply to Bob, 04-10-2007 09:23:32

:o) :o) Gee ,,Arent these family farms just the greatest though,, Ya Wills dont mean squat. Land aint yours till you got your name on the deed and when ya buy it it aint yours till the mortgages is paid..I been though it all and i guess for the most part it worked out ok but if i could live it all over from the start when i turned 18 i would run like hell and as far from farm and family as i could get.Its been a hell of a ride and an eye opening experience and thank god its all in the past and im looking forward to moven on. :o)

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Bob

04-10-2007 12:10:20

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Re: Family farm relationships.... Comments wanted. in reply to 4010guy, 04-10-2007 12:03:30

I guess I didn't do a very good job of making my "point" which basically was that after 40 years of working into the farming operation, if Mr.CatCummins would have had more "say" in the operation of the farm he would have been able to spare himself from having to deal with the "poor choice" his late Dad made when trading tractors, then he wouldn't have to "dis" any one make over another!

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Glen in TX

04-09-2007 21:59:07

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

Yeah lots of cubic inch differences there so what did you expect? Green magic? lol. Guess I can compare it like that gutless wonder POS Cummins 250 engine to a 400 engine and what was CAT ever thinking about a 3208 and others before that? CATS are real DOGS in a fire truck compared to a new DETROIT ! :)

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:28:52

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Glen in TX, 04-09-2007 21:59:07

For the amount of money we paid for the green piece of ^&%$ maybe i was expecting some kind of magic. we could have bought a 425 horse Case quadtrac for pretty much the same price as we paid for the JD. I think John Deere is just getting ahead of themselves, all people pay for when they buy a new john deere tractor is the color of the paint.

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MIKE FRENCH

04-09-2007 21:57:45

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

Sorry, john deere never made a 4x4 tractor that was any good (well around here). The steigers ate em up. Just my 2 cents worth for what its worth.

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:00:57

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to MIKE FRENCH, 04-09-2007 21:57:45

Ya no doubt, thats what i am getting at too, the old stiegers were twice the tractor, we have had numerous Johns over the years and they all just sucked, the 8460... JUNK. had a 4430 and a 4450 in the early 80's, they were also horrible for power, just so boggy, you can't beat cat and cummins. I am sorry fellas!

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Bob

04-09-2007 21:31:21

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

Versatile.... 1150 Cubic inches

Deere..... .. 766 Cubic inches

You're surprised there's a difference in lugging power???

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4010guy

04-09-2007 22:00:07

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-09-2007 21:31:21

You are exactly rite there bob...And i have always wondered why after all these years Deere doesn't build an engine with some bigger cubes so they could pick them selves up ??? I dont think there was a nicer tractor built to sit in all day,,,I got an old one and i liked it but just no power.

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Bob

04-09-2007 22:20:16

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to 4010guy, 04-09-2007 22:00:07

I put about 7000 hours on this 'ol girl. Dynoed @ 285 HP.

A TOY by today's standards; but it did a LOT of work for me. The photo was taken in the early 80's. I still have it.

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Billpa

04-10-2007 03:27:59

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-09-2007 22:20:16

I havent herd anybody say anything about fuel economy yet?

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Cummins/Cat

04-10-2007 07:21:38

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Billpa, 04-10-2007 03:27:59

The Cummins was very easy on fuel for the size of it, because it was never really working hard to pull anything averaging usually around 15 gallons an hour. The john deere on the other hand was guzzling 20 gallons an hour trying to pull the 60 foot air drill in soft ground last spring and it can't even pull our rome plow in hard ground so what good was that?

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4010guy

04-09-2007 22:30:06

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-09-2007 22:20:16

Yep,,Looks good all rite,,,So you getting snow over there yet,,,Just came in from out side,,No snow or rain but windy er than all get out and damn COLD...

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Bob

04-09-2007 22:38:28

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to 4010guy, 04-09-2007 22:30:06

I'm in north central ND. I think the snow is supposed to stay south of us. You're west aren't you?

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4010guy

04-09-2007 22:41:53

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Bob, 04-09-2007 22:38:28

Ya,,west and north,,,10 12 miles from border

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4010guy

04-09-2007 21:26:40

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to Cummins/Cat, 04-09-2007 21:16:50

As far as the bigger 4WDs are concerned, YES,,I agree with you totally....Now i know there are some johndeere guys on here are not,,,glen comes to mind.;o) O well..sorry..Guess we all have our opinions hey.

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francis pawelek

04-19-2007 20:26:11

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Re: Johndeere engines.....thumbs down..way down. in reply to 4010guy, 04-09-2007 21:26:40

hi again in tx,my old 8630 isstill doing fine pulling its old 26 foot 235 disc,,maybe some of the 8630s didn"t all get the motor upgrade when john deere was pulling the factory motors and putting in 8650 engines,they are very reliable too,mine is still going strong,but then aside from my 7020,i like the quiet 8630 cab unlike my 7020 fully restored inside the cab when running is still too loud,any cures out there besides the loud stereo?

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