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O/T Heating With Coal

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37 chief

12-22-2007 14:02:49




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Is coal still used for heating in the homes back where it really gets cold? When my Mom was growing up on a farm in the 20's and 30's in Minott North Dekota, she told me coal was used for heat. My primary heas source is a wood stove. If I wanted to pay the electric bill I could use electric heat. The wood works for now. Whad do othere use for heat. Stan




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Spook

12-23-2007 12:32:11




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
The economics change, with some surprises. When my house was built in the early 70's, electric heat was popular. The power companies even offered a discounted rate for all electric homes. By the mid 80's the p[ower companies had discontinued the low rates. Propane became cheaper. Now propane is higher than electric. Geothermal sounds good, not likely "market" forces can change that !!!



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reply

12-23-2007 04:56:22




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
more and more people going to coal. Check out the site below. Link



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Bill(Wis)

12-23-2007 03:53:11




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Coal produces 8 times as much ash as wood and the ashes will poison your soil whereas wood ashes will fertilize the soil. If I remember correctly, one ton of coal will produce as much heat as two cords of wood. I remember reading that in an old publication and it stipulated that that was for "steam purposes".



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Bill(Wis)

12-23-2007 04:31:26




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to Bill(Wis), 12-23-2007 03:53:11  
I do remember heating our 1700 sq ft uninsulated farm house with about one ton of coal per month in the coldest weather. Coal cost about $30 per ton then. (50s)



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buickanddeere

12-22-2007 20:34:37




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Around here most people tore the coal stokers out in the 1980's & 1990's and replaced then with "cheap" natural gas furnaces. A lot of crying now after natural gas prices increased and the local coal dealer hardly raised prices by comparison. The railroad is gone now so the coal dealer brings it in via tractor trailer from Pennsylvania.



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Clefus

12-22-2007 19:34:46




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
I live in w. pa and have a nat gas furnace...but only use it as a backup...
Main heat is from coal...
I have a Hitzer 82 in the basement and a 55 in the attached garage....I use about 8 ton of bituminous nut per year ... costs $50 ton at the local yard 10 miles away....

That $50 to $75 per month in coal along with a little shoveling saves a hundred or two in gas bills....each month..



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wyod

12-22-2007 18:24:22




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Hey Stan,
I spent several years in England (courtesy of my Uncle Sam) a few years back... every place I lived was heated with coal. I really liked it, although it took a bit of getting used to. Not as easy as just turing up the thermostat! The systems I used there were boilers that ran hot water radiators... by British standards (at least at that time) they were "state of the art". A good friend here in the states built a new place a few years back and installed a coal fired system. With his, you auger coal into a hopper that is located directly above his basement utility room. The coal self-feeds into his boiler. Except for hauling coal each August, his system is virtually on auto-pilot. It heats all his hot water too! D

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4010guy

12-22-2007 18:01:04




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Hi 37 chief
Well i live nw of why not Minot and i still got an old hand fired coal furnace in the basement that was installed when the house was built.,,Im probably the last guy out here to still use a HAND FIRED furnace.
I heat with electric baseboards in the spring and fall but i like my coal when it gets below o and thats when the coal burns the best.
Most of the people that use coal have stockers but i get buy as the furnace is good sized and has a automatic damper and i only service about twice a day and if we are gone for the day the baseboards kick in.
as far as price gos its not that great of a savings,,,About $200.00 or more a year and i have my own truck to haul it and live ware i can easily dispose of the ashes but when for like bob says when its 30 below and windy out side im sitting in my living room nice and comp-fee at 85 i like it lots. :o) As far as the dust is concerned yes our basement is not by any means squeaky clean but we keep the filters changed often in the forced air and the natural draft with the hand fed is WAAAAA Y cleaner than a stoker but not as reliable.
And also im not sure how much more i pay for my house insurance. (not a lot more) But the insurance company's dont really like solid fuel heating systems.

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Iowayes

12-22-2007 17:59:20




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Wow, Makes me think of the good old days when I was at home, shovel coal and burn wood. That smell still lingers in my mind. Nothing like the smell of coal burning on a cold cold day and go in side after doing chores,milking by hand, ginding feed for the fats and milk cows, and open the door to the furnace to warm the hind end. The only time I get to smell the coal burning is when we are at a antique show with steam engines and some times or most of the time they burn wood.

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fixerupper

12-22-2007 17:51:35




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
While we are on the subject of burning coal, yesterday I found an old building supply catalog from sometime in the 1920's so I looked to see what they had to offer for furnaces. What I find is a 'Van Tine' coal burning 'pipe furnace' which is a 'hot air' furnace in modern terms. The price ranges from $62.00 for one that will heat 8000 cu. ft., to $129.00 for one that heats 35000 cu. ft. The small furnace weighs 850 lb. and the big one weighs 1600 lb. They also sold hot water and steam units. There's a long list of steam and hot water radiators with all kinds of dimensions but one example is an 8 section, 38" tall radiator with 4 sq.feet per section would cost $13.40 if my calculations are right. Kind of interesting! Jim

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dave guest

12-22-2007 17:36:04




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
When I was a kid in Detroit, we had octopus coal furnace. Had to shovel and coal was about half size of football. Must have been cheaper or something. Lotta people used very fine stuff. Maybe coke. And rich people had stokers which I though was marvelous with electric motor and chain drives. Still have the shovel we used 59 years ago. Only got cold if the fire went out and took a long time to get it going. Maybe anchracite. First paper and cardboard, then wood, then coal. Used to lay on the floor and put you feet on register. Heat didn't travel too far. Good old days. Like to go back for day or two.

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El Toro

12-22-2007 17:17:30




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
We used coal for years at home. When I was in the Army back in 1954 they were wanting volunteers
to fire the coal furnaces for the high grade officers at Ft Bragg NC. You didn't need to pull any guard duty or any other company duties. The general officers all had stokers and we had one on the farm. These were all boilers since they
had radiators. The weather was mild in NC and didn't need to fire them very heavy. Hal

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JMS/.MN

12-23-2007 11:15:21




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to El Toro, 12-22-2007 17:17:30  
Ft. Bragg still had the coal stoves in the SF Training Center on Smoke Bomb Hill, mid 60s.



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El Toro

12-23-2007 12:13:53




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to JMS/.MN, 12-23-2007 11:15:21  
I was in the Division Artillery area known as Divarty. I lived at Spring Lake. We even got some extra money for firing those furnaces along with our jump pay. Our mess halls all had coal cook stoves. They had them at Ft Benning too. We used coal to heat the milk house and the hot water at home. Hal



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John T

12-22-2007 16:38:39




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
For several years we heated with a stoker coal furnace n THERES NUTTIN WARMER N BONE PENETRATING wooooo oooo hooooo oooo. There was a hugeeeee ee difference in the coal we used. The cheap soft dirty high sulfur local southern Indiana coal left a ton of clinkers n was dirty n sooty. HOWEVER when I paid more for that easten Kentucky hard coal it left like NO clinkers, burned every last drop, yielded more heat per ton, heck it was so hard n shiny your hands didnt even get black if you handled it.....

John T BTDT n got the coal furnace T Shirt

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CENTAUR

12-22-2007 15:44:52




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Since nuclear is the cheapest and the cleanest why do we not use it as it will do most of what we want done.It is excellent for heated floors,with electrical or heated water.The state of AK. has ordered seven modular plants from toshiba of JAPAN and it is an oil producer!Goggle (MODULAR NUCLEAR PLANTS) for lots of info. CENTAUR



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CENTAUR

12-22-2007 15:43:59




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Since nuclear is the cheapest and the cleanest why do we not use it as it will do most of what we want done.It is excellent for heated floors,with electrical or heated water.The state of AK. has ordered seven modular plants from toshiba of JAPAN and it is an oil producer!Goggle (MODULAR NUCLEAR PLANTS) for lots of info. CENTAUR



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Rollie NE PA

12-22-2007 15:42:08




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
I installed a coal stoker in my detached garage/ shop and piped the hot water into my oil burner. I have baseboard hot water heat. My domestic water is also heated from the coal stoker.

I am in the coal region so getting coal is easy. I bought coal during the summer for $123.00 a ton. The residual heat from the coal stoker keeps my garage warm and the dust from the stoker is confined to the garage.

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Bob Collins

12-22-2007 15:32:49




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
When I moved into my house in 1971 it had a steam boiler fired with a coal stoker, we bought a truckload of coal every year usually 12-15 tons, which would last all winter. At first it was $27.50 a ton and climbed to more than $70 when we converted to LP fired high efficiency boilers (two) about 10 years ago. With the coal the celler was always warm because the fire never went out. Now it is much cooler down there which may be more cost effective but I miss the warmth. I usually handled all of the coal a minimum of 2 times, sometimes if the truck dumped it 50 feet from the celler it was 3 times (counting ash removal) which meant I got more heat from it.

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Larry59

12-22-2007 15:22:37




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
:) Heated with and old pot belly wood stove in house. Remember one winter running out of wood to heat. Dad was 50 miles away working in city and could not get home. Being the oldest of 3 at 10 yrs. I was out in bitter cold and with ax tearing down one of our wood sheds for more wood that burn't up quick. Hope I never have to do that one again. Do have outside wood furnace I use at times here in winter. ....One problem was no dam heat in that outhouse. Burrrrr rrrrr and when dad added that second hole for girls only. The updraft would come out that hole as you set there. Burrrrr and one dare not pea on the out rim of the boys. Turn to ice and that was a real problem at times. Ho Ho Ho .. Happy Holidays to all. :)

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John S-B

12-22-2007 15:03:06




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
We had a coal furnace in one of the houses that we lived in when I was a kid. Total Pain in the a$$, and messy. We had to wash the walls and shampoo the carpet all the time because of the soot. Plus we did not have a stoker so you had to manually keep it going and the temp was uneven. It might be nice if I lived in the country and could have a outdoor furnance away from the house with a stoker, but you would probably have to be close to a mine and haul it yourself to make it worthwile.

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Midwest redneck

12-22-2007 15:02:29




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
I heat with Propane when I am not home and when I am home I heat with wood pellets and corn. Coal gives off a lot of heat but it filthly to burn. I could heat my house all winter on $1000 worth of wood pellets. (about 1/2 the cost of Propane)



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noncompos

12-22-2007 14:52:29




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Here in the Northwest, where for decades the mainstay of the economy was lumber, there were sawdust stoves and furnaces...our first Portland house had an old octopus furnace, and the basement beams still had sawdust on top, covered by coal dust from when coal replaced sawdust. When we bought the house an oil burner had been stuck in the cleanout door (very common) and we burned oil. If you"ve ever shovelled coal, cleaned out the cinders, etc, you know why oil or gas burners were stuffed into the old furnaces...

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IaGary

12-22-2007 14:24:56




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
90% of the homes here in eastern Ia are heated with LP gas in the country and Natural gas in the cities.

There is a lot of new houses being built with Geo Thermal heat now.

In the 70's a lot of houses were switched over to gas from fuel oil.

Fuel oil replaced coal in the 50's and 60's here.

All economics. The switch is to the cheapest heat source of the time.

Gary



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jdemaris

12-22-2007 14:32:34




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to IaGary, 12-22-2007 14:24:56  
I wonder about the economics. I don't claim to know the answer, but why is the majority of electrcity generated in the U.S. done with coal, instead of oil, if oil is cheaper? I suspect coal is cheaper when used in bulk - but it's not "consumer friendly." It's requires getting dirty, loading a coal furnace or stove by hand (well, most setups), etc. When my dad went to grammar school, every boy in the class had to take a turn loading the coal stove. The girls didn't have to. Boy, things have changed.

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IaGary

12-22-2007 14:40:03




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to jdemaris, 12-22-2007 14:32:34  
Coal probably is cheaper when you can get it by the rail car load.

But try and get a ton of it deleivered and see what it costs.

The switch to fuel oil was more economics in handling and ease to get to the furnace then the cost of the product itself.

Gary



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jdemaris

12-22-2007 14:47:28




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to IaGary, 12-22-2007 14:40:03  
Yes, I don't see too many houses being built with coal-chutes nowadays.



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jdemaris

12-22-2007 14:11:38




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
Some people still use it here in NY. It's not exactly cheap anymore. We don't get the big train-loads of it coming in, as it did years ago.
On the other hand, most electricity is still made in the US from burning coal, so the power companies buy a lot.



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Bob

12-22-2007 14:06:28




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to 37 chief, 12-22-2007 14:02:49  
I heat my 50' X 75' shop in northern ND with a coal stoker furnace burning Wyoming lignite, for less than $1000.00 per winter.



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Walt Davies

12-22-2007 14:47:27




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to Bob, 12-22-2007 14:06:28  
WOW! I heat my entire house with Pellets for half that.
Walt



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Bob

12-22-2007 16:50:44




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to Walt Davies, 12-22-2007 14:47:27  
Does it get a low as -30º(F) where you live???



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IaGary

12-22-2007 14:59:42




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to Walt Davies, 12-22-2007 14:47:27  
Yes pellets would be cheaper for you than coal but geothermal is about half or less than what pellets are.

But the cost to install Geo thermal would be 2 1/2 times a pellet burner.

So you have to decide do you want to pay up front (Geo Thermal) or pay as you go (pellets).

Gary



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Bob

12-22-2007 16:26:00




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to IaGary, 12-22-2007 14:59:42  
"Yes pellets would be cheaper for you than coal but geothermal is about half or less than what pellets are."

WOW... pellets CHEAPER than coal... I WISH that was the situation around here!



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IaGary

12-22-2007 20:06:43




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 Re: O/T Heating With Coal in reply to Bob, 12-22-2007 16:26:00  
Bob I should have said pellets may be cheaper than coal for walt.

And you get a lot more cold days in ND than we do here in Iowa thats for sure.

Gary



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