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OT --corral too muddy, how to improve?

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midlam

02-09-2008 06:07:47




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My corral gets too muddy to use. Whats a good way to make things more solid? Its only used a few weeks in spring and fall. would this work? scrape a foot of ground off
make shallow trenches 5 feet apart
lay black fabric
press fabric down and lay 4 " drain tile in trenches
cover with recycled highway payment chips.




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hayray

02-09-2008 16:47:56




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
I use wood chips that I get for free from tree trimmers. Wood chips form a real good pad that I can drive my big tractors on, takes about a year to break down.



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kyhayman

02-09-2008 15:43:27




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
I'd build it just like a feeding pad or other heavy use area. First ditch it and crown it so water will have a place to go. Make sure it has a discharge point. Then cover with geotextile filter fabric. Top with 4-6 inches of 2 inch crushed stone, then top that with 4-6 inches of class I sand. I feed on one and its held up nicely, been in place since 1995. Usually every 3 years or so I have to put 20-25 tons of class I back on it for a 48x72 pad but I'm scraping it 4-5 times in a winter. The class I sand is just a coarser version of lime so it doesnt hurt anything to be in with the manure. In a corral it probably wont matter but I changed from using a metal scraper to a rubber tire scraper and it cut way down on the damage I was doing to the pad. Check with NRCS on plans for heavy use areas.

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dave2

02-09-2008 12:45:13




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to J.C.H., 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
I've done two places for the horses and getting ready for another this year with stuff like in the links below. one place had quite a bit of clay and the other had been a wheat field for years. I built both on top of the ground I had. For the plastic (on the clay), ran a vibrating packer over it, bordered the area with the concrete ones, leveled the area inside with about 2 inches of max 1/4 inch slag, layed the plastic pavers, filled everything with sand and ran over again with the packer. Horses make fools of themselves on it, I drive over it etc, etc. and no problems.

For the concrete ones (better eat your Wheaties), just flattened/leveled the place off with some max 1 1/2 inch limestone, layed the pavers, filled with a mix of sand and 1/4 inch slag, run the packer and covered with about an inch of sand. This mixed with manure and walked in real good over a couple of months works real well. Will be doing a roundpen in a month or so the same way. These things cost a little more, but when you figure the saved labor and materials, you may come out better. Good luck.

Dave

Link

http://www.countymaterials.com/f_products/landscaping/muni_grassPavers.shtml

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Larry NE IL

02-09-2008 11:54:39




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Here is how my horse lot is: Dug it about 12"-14" deep. Laid filter fabric that is used for paving. Covered with about 8" of 3" crushed rock, then topped with lime screenings. You loose some of the screenings when you clean when it's sloppy, but the lime is good for the soil anyway.
Even when sloppy there is a bottom to it and it's easy to clean.



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Jerry/MT

02-09-2008 10:58:05




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
I don"t know what you mean by "chips".

If I were you, I"d lay 1-1/4 ballast rock( no fines) down first then make a groove in them and lay the pipe in the groove and add more ballast then put the landscape cloth over that. (You want the landscape cloth to act as a filter for the dirt so you drains don"t get clogged with it.) I lived in an 80 inch rainfall area that"s how the excavating contractors handled wet spots.

I can tell you what I"m doing as I build my working corral. I have scraped off about 12-15 inches of top soil. I am planning on bringing in 12-15 inches of sand. If I had any low spots that will tend to collect water, I would dig them out about 6-8 additional inches, bring in 1-1/4 inch ballast, lay a drain pipe in a groove on that, connecting it to a lower spot so that water drains away, add more ballast, cover with landscape cloth and then cover with sand.
I live in a ~16 inches of annual rain area so I think what I"m doing will work well for me. If you live in a higher annual rain fall area you may want to slope the corral toward the middle, bring in ballast, lay it down 5-8feet from the centerline and about a foot deep, groove it along the centerline and lay in your drain pipe and drain to a low spot outside of the corral, cover with more balast, then landscape cloth that sand. Your local NRCS or Conservation District should be able to provide you with recommendations.
Hope this helps you.

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flying belgian

02-09-2008 09:52:22




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
We used to dump corn cobs in the cow yard. They worked real good but I suppose knowone has them anymore.



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Eric SEI

02-09-2008 19:56:43




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to flying belgian, 02-09-2008 09:52:22  
Plenty of farmers around here still put up some ear corn. Those with cattle still like ground ear corn for them. Just a couple years ago I saw 3 corn pickers in one field. Most corn is combined and hauled to the river, but not all of it.



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Walt Davies

02-09-2008 09:41:18




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
scrape out as much as you can then put in a heavy rock base of 3 or 4 in rocks then add 3/4 minus to the top of this then put what ever is easy to walk on on the top of that and you will soon have a soild base that will standup to cattle feet. Its not cheap but if you want to make it work its what you have to do.
Walt



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old

02-09-2008 07:53:45




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Theres a number of ways the fix that problem. One is to get the lever of the ground up higher then the ground around it, 2 is to mix sand or saw dust with the dirt or both. No matter what you need to get it so it drains off and raising the level up will do that but you also have to have something in that dirt that will let the water out of it. If its a heavy clay then it will try to stay wet no matter what because clay holds water.

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TVB

02-09-2008 07:47:01




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
If you can afford it put about 18" of sand on top, sand will not absorb moisture. I put sand in my corral and horse pen it works great. You need to set it up so it will drain properly.



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Mike (WA)

02-09-2008 07:39:51




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
I'm sure many of the suggestions below would keep it from mudding up, but if you're keeping cattle in the corral, there will be manure, and unless you're getting the manure out by hand, whatever you put in the corral will end up on the fields when you spread the manure. We finally went to about a foot depth of "hog fuel" (so named because the waste wood burners in lumber mills used to be called "hogs", so the stuff you burned in them was "hog fuel"). It is shredded bark and wood, has much more body than sawdust or shavings. Moisture goes down through, and it will last about 2 winters before breaking down. By then its pretty much composted, and you can just spread it on the fields.

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rrlund

02-09-2008 07:29:07




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Do you mean crushed asphalt? Stuff packs in like concrete. My brother is in the excavating business. He tore up a parking lot and spread it in one of my driveways where the milk truck backed in every day (semi).It held up for the rest of the years that we milked and still is. Needs to be 8-12 inches thick to hold up well. Like you said,scrape the mud out first. I don't see the need for drain tile. Water won't penertate it anyway. Little tip though,you'll need a bulldozer to level the stuff.

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midlam

02-09-2008 08:45:20




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to rrlund, 02-09-2008 07:29:07  
no, the stuff is from I-69, a state highway.



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Allan In NE

02-09-2008 07:17:58




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Taller overshoes.

Allan



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midlam

02-09-2008 08:53:21




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to Allan In NE, 02-09-2008 07:17:58  
wet sticky clay. I have had my boots pull off. If they don't pull off, each boot has 10 pounds of mud stuck to it. If a cow hit me just right, and I am stuck in like a fence post,I think it would break my back.
Have seen calves almost get stuck. They get stepped by the cows before getting free.



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TomH in PA

02-09-2008 07:08:22




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Where's the water coming from? First thing is to divert any runoff (rain gutters on the barn, drain tiles up hill). If it's still unusable I'd build up the middle with the stone so it drains better. Don't scrape off that foot of ground first, make a low mound so the water can flow away.



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Janicholson

02-09-2008 07:03:59




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Drainage with tile if there is a place to go down hill that does not lead directly into a stream or pond (too much runoff to go directly into a riparian system) then mix in road base crushed limestone. It is a mix of fines, 1/4" 3/8" and 1/2" material it might be necessary to remove about 50% of the existing material then mix in the Base. I would do tile when it is easy to move the soil, and mix in the base when much dryer. JimN

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Leland

02-09-2008 07:03:10




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
The recycled chips would be alright as long as you put enough down that the critters don't stomp it down and bring the mud back up ,one lot on a farm I worked on they put in a couple of feet of old railroad ballest from a line they tore up it worked good .



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midlam

02-09-2008 06:52:37




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
oh, I forgot to say that the ground is heavy clay.
really gets bad if the cattle are left in overnight.



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JD9295

02-09-2008 06:47:08




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
our local recycler has a machine that strips the rubber insulation and grinds it into small pieces
it makes great corral material and they usually call around looking for someplace to dump it



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Texasmark

02-09-2008 06:44:12




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Here in N. Texas we have a soft rock commonly called Calichie which is usually used as a base for some roads and any driveway (base) or similar work around the farm. It is mined and crushed so you get powder and some larger pieces to say 2-3 inches.

It has two distinct advantages that I like when considered for animal heavy traffic areas.

1. It is soft and packs. Over time the big chunks dissolve and makes a smooth surface. It easily supports the weight of cows in heavy traffic areas including when wet. After a wet spell, there will be some footprints in it, depth depending on a lot of things, but for me 1" or so is normal, which are easily box bladed out when it dries. Animal traffic on that will pack it down and you're ready for another round of wet weather.

2. Being a soft rock, there are no hard pieces to get lodged in the animals feet and cause problems. Like I said, once the chunks dissolve (first wet spell) it is all compressible powder that packs to a smooth surface.

Might check with your local "rock bucket" haulers and tell them what you need the rock to do and get their advice.

It is one of the lower cost materials here so that makes it nicer.

HTH,

Mark

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Armand Tatro

02-09-2008 06:41:34




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
Ag lime works real good and if you dig some of it up when cleaning the lot it is good for your fields. Packs real good also. Armand



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deadeye012

02-09-2008 06:34:10




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 Re: OT --corral too muddy, how to improve? in reply to midlam, 02-09-2008 06:07:47  
As a cover, use saw dust if you got a sawmill around close....JB



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