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Need some idea that are easy to do

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old

03-19-2008 13:22:35




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Well I just rode my son Honda down by the creek to see what if any damages where done.In one place I lost about 10 foot of creek bank about 100-200 feet long. So I need some ideas of how to stop loosening ground/land to the creek. Thanks




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MarkinMO

03-20-2008 06:56:39




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Don't know if you saw the article in the recent Missouri Farm Bureau magazine but check this out - Link



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bill in the ozarks

03-19-2008 19:12:59




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
hello old concerning your water problem over there my son-in-law lives right next door to the creek he had the same problem you have you can call willards quarry and get truck loads of real large rock you have to put it as high as your bank in order for it to hold this one is holding really good this creek got really wild good luck ps willard quarries is located right there in lebanon



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old

03-19-2008 21:00:29




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to bill in the ozarks, 03-19-2008 19:12:59  
The problem there is the cost of having it hauled to my place. I know the place since I have hauled out of Willard more then once back when I drove dump trucks



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Scott in SF

03-19-2008 19:03:51




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Have you tried checking with the local NRCS or Soil Conservation Dist. Perhabs they will have some ideas about stabilization, maby plant some schrubs or grass or something. Definately keep the cattle and hogs out of it.



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James22

03-19-2008 18:56:44




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Several local water shed districts are using willow trees to control stream bank erosion. Apparently you can shove a willow branch/twig into the soil and it will grow. They have held several working classes demonstrating the technique. I believe they need to be placed near constant water supply to work well. However I don't believe they will solve erosion in the stream's curves/bends during the flood season's rapid water flow. Rip-rap rock is the prescribed solution for these areas.

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dr sportster

03-19-2008 18:13:44




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
I heard or saw on TV that as time goes on rivers tend to get straighter.S curves erode and things change.



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Allan In NE

03-19-2008 18:04:46




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
You're not gonna stop it.

That water will go where it wants. Build a Hoover Dam and if ya get enough water, it will wash away.

You get the creek; the neighbor across on the other bank gets the land.

In our hemisphere, the rivers and creeks crawl towards the north; never ending.

Allan



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Kansas Cockshutt

03-20-2008 00:40:37




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to Allan In NE, 03-19-2008 18:04:46  
Yupper. Ol' Mother nature has a good way of doing that to us.



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GeneMO

03-19-2008 16:17:29




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Re-read your subject line a little closer. My method is not real easy to do.


Gene



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GeneMO

03-19-2008 16:17:14




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Re-read your subject line a little closer. My method is not real easy to do.


Gene



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GeneMO

03-19-2008 15:45:06




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Hi Old, I went down to my creek yesterday afternoon to inspect my cedar tree revetment. Someone else sort of addressed it. You do NOT need a permit, IF you work with the Missouri Department of Conservation. I have about 400' of bank line that we stabalized 6 years ago. We cut about 100 big red cedar trees and dragged them to the creek. This was about our only cost or contribution. MDC personnel from the fisheries division came out with help, provided the "duck bill anchors", cable, and clamps and the jack hammer tool to drive the anchors in deep in the creek bank. I pushed the trees over the bank to them, and they cabled them to the bank. They layererd them in and secured the whole thing with cables.

It is working good. Silt and creek bank cements the trees in place. eventually sycamore, soft maple and willows grow up, the bank tapers in some and it is holding good. Also provides some fish habbitat it the otters havent gotten them all yet.

I'll post some pictures later. Our cost was zero, other than some labor and tractor work.

You may need help with the tree cutting due to your back.

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GeneMO

03-19-2008 15:52:44




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to GeneMO, 03-19-2008 15:45:06  
Forgot to mention, I also planted several thousand trees along the creek. It is a "Continious CRP" project here in MO. I was reimbursed for the cost of the trees and fencing. I had to fence it from cattle, but I am getting paid something like $70 or $75 per acres for the next 15 years. I was going to loose it to the creek anyway if I didn't do something. Here it is called a Riparian Buffer.

I have trees that are 15'+ now.


Gene

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old

03-19-2008 16:19:21




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to GeneMO, 03-19-2008 15:52:44  
Gene, I already put in a call to the conservation office and should here something in a day or 2



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TomH in PA

03-19-2008 15:41:36




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Talk to the Soil Conservation Service. They'll probably offer to put the stream bank into CREP, plant trees for free, and pay you rent on it for the next 15 years. CREP requires a buffer strip at least 35 feet wide, but you can make it wider if you want



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Marlowe

03-19-2008 15:35:50




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
the first thing you must do is GET A permit from your DNR or however is in charge of your water ways. i know the creek is on your land and you will most likely pay and do the work the DNR or who ever will have control over it. don't try to fix it on the sly because they will find out and the it will be a big mess. i work with these jerks 5 or 6 times a year they cane mike your lift miserable



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chuck t

03-19-2008 15:33:22




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Old - the Missouri Dept. of Conservation has a lot of stuff to help. Get on their site and look up a private land manager for your county. They will come look at it and give ideas, as well as help with wildlife management. It's free advice from a trained professional.



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NE IA

03-19-2008 15:00:52




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
In the last five years we lost two towns and part of another. The sand piles along the river bottoms that the flood left were not alowed to be returned to the river even. I know one was sixty ft by four hundred ft and probably four to five feet hugh. That soil had to be hauled off, not pushed back in the river where it came from.

One of the towns was buried across the river and a quarter mile from the river bank right after the flood. After a year with idiots from FEMA the rest had to be hauled thirty five miles away to a land fill. I know of a brand new stainless steel chimney that had never been used was not to be salvaged, but I could not buy into that and it turned up stolen by the time the dozers got there. If folks had not been promised by the politicians that they would get funding for loosing their homes it would not have been so bad. It took two years before the first checks were issued.

A word to the wise that live near a flood prone areas. Of course you want your property taxes lowered or as low as possible. Once a flood comes you will get your wish, your property will be valued --low as you requested.

Years ago rivers were the property markers often, and if the river cut a new chanel, you won more or lost some land. Near a small town, there was a lot of explosions during a flood, so the law had to step in and correct the issue.

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noncompos

03-19-2008 14:40:40




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
All good ideas so far if creek wholly on your place, but you should make discreet inquiries as to watercourse regulations, if any, in your area (remember, civil servants are all overworked, so it's unfair to add to their workload unnecessarily by asking them questions)--if creek is a boundary you might need to coordinate with other owner. If creek centerline is boundary also remember general rule (which may or may not apply to your case) that if centerline change slow and gradual (natural) boundary changes with centerline, but if change rapid, sudden (flood, etc) boundary STAYS IN OLD CENTERLINE LOCATION.

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glennster

03-19-2008 14:31:23




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
i lost a lot of creek bank too this year. i found a guy that had a huge pile of concrete from an old barn foundation, no rebar, clean concrete, some slabs are near 8x10 ft, 8-10 inches thick. i plan on lining the creek wall with these to stop the current from under cutting the bank.



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Billy NY

03-19-2008 14:28:02




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
It is rather tough to fight mother nature, not sure what you could do with the bank as is, wait til the water level goes down, do some work to reduce the slope angle, and place some heavy rubble, or rip-rap as they call it here. Broken concrete would work too. Large pieces of crushed rock or anything similar. Also wonder if you are allowed or are restricted from doing any work along a waterway like that by any authority presiding over such matters, or if any could provide assistance, private land so maybe none of that applies. Somehow have to shape what is left and fill in with rubble, and it's never a guarantee that it will last, 100 year flood could undermine something man made just the same. The only thing that would really last is sheet piling, which would be cost prohibitive I am sure.

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phillip d

03-19-2008 13:42:05




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Hi Old,we have severe erosion issues here on PEI and some people dump granit along the banks and strap them in with cage wire.If you want alot simpler ideas,maybe old cement will work just dumped along the banks.Say maybe blocks of old foundations,concrete form demolished tower silo's,just about anything you can get ahold of cheap or free to keep the soil in it's place.



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Michael Soldan

03-19-2008 13:41:42




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to old, 03-19-2008 13:22:35  
Where I live we take the stones we picked off the fields and we place them along the areas that might erode, the stones in a layer over the side of the bank will stop the erosion by probably 95%..they slow the flow and protect the soil under them.



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Janicholson

03-19-2008 15:33:02




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to Michael Soldan, 03-19-2008 13:41:42  
Michael's Idea is the best of those given so far. The natural stone goes along with the river much better than broken chunks of concrete. But there may be a serious violation of law. In MN a man had placed 100' of field stone boulders into the water/mud of his property on a lake(just six feet wide to stabilize his frontage to allow realistic access to the actual water W/O getting into mud.
Fined many $$$
Had to remove all Stone (big $$$)
Maybe they just grew there?
JimN

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JMS/.MN

03-19-2008 16:51:14




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 Re: Need some idea that are easy to do in reply to Janicholson, 03-19-2008 15:33:02  
It could be that you are on to something there. No shortage of rock growing in the farm fields, and there is plenty of fertilizer runoff from the over-fertilized lawns around the lakes and along the rivers.



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