Re: Tillage and Welding experts

Posted by Paul in MN on May 05, 2009 at 10:33:48 from (71.210.130.188):

In Reply to: Tillage and Welding experts posted by Billy NY on May 05, 2009 at 07:44:44:

Billy,

Just a few thoughts here as I am not familiar with that disc.

When the disc folds does it hit some kind of stop before the cylinder has run out of travel? The cylinder has huge forces and can be causing the ripped metal. Possibly you need to readjust the position of the cylinder so the cylinder is at the end of its travel just prior to the folding section hitting its stop. Or maybe you need a collar fitting on the cylinder ram to limit the cylinder stroke. Did the disc come with these lifting cylinders, or are they just a common size like a 3" x 8"? My thought here is that you can limit the force applied by chosing a smaller diameter cylinder...maybe a 2.5" x 8". On our different brand disc, the 2.5" diameter cylinder gives plenty of lift force.

Were the cylinders sized for the old standard 2500 psi hydraulic systems common to many tractor brands? And is he using a newer tractor that puts out 3500 or 4000 psi to the remotes? The higher pressures will rip things apart if no pressure limiting (relief) valve is used on the implement's hydraulics.

As to the welding, if you are using a mild steel like a 60 series, then it would be best to use a 60 series welding rod. Deep penetration can be had with the common 6011, and it can be run with AC or DC. The 7018 is a low hydrogen rod which is designed for high carbon steel. It can be run on AC or DC, but my experience suggests that it gives a more brittle weld or brittleness next to the weld. I think this can be reduced by preheating the base metal (w/torch) prior to welding.

My experience with my newer JD (and other brands as well) equipment is that they are using high carbon (high strength) steel in high impact stress places where it fails due to its more brittle nature. And welding repairs just make it even more brittle and ready to break again. So I have added "patch plates" to the repaired original metal that are known to be common hot rolled steel. This seems to withstand impact better. When welding such patch plates, do not fully weld the perimeter of the plate as it will probably cause the base metal to tear out completely. Thus the design with the "stitch welded" pieces. And make the patch plate cover a bigger area so you spread out the impact forces.

Have you had any experience in making knife blades or swords (or even plow shears)? Basically you want the high carbon steel only on the cutting edge, but the body of the blade needs to be tough but flexible (softer steel) or the blade will have a very short life before it is snapped off. I wish the current stock of Ag engineers who are specing out the materials for new equipment had some of this kind of experience. They should be required to serve a 6 month "apprenticeship" with a good blacksmith. The final product might be a whole lot better.

Good luck with solving this problem.

Paul in MN

P.S. I am neither a welding expert nor a tillage expert, but do have some experience in both areas, and am a member of a blacksmithing group. Maybe some real expert will respond as well.

Replies:

• Re: Tillage and Welding experts Billy NY 11:05:11 05/05/09 (0)

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