Re: Electricity price

Posted by John T on December 14, 2009 at 07:49:17 from (66.244.97.31):

In Reply to: Electricity price posted by 37 chief on December 13, 2009 at 18:34:08:

WOW the guy asked a simple question and Id think if a person provided him a well thought out "ballpark estimate" people should be pleased.....

The ONLY way to give a "perfect" answer would be to measure the actual load and actual current draw and then see how the utility charges including the KWH rate and any poor power factor penalties and time of use (peak times may charge more). I view the utility as billing for Killowatt Hours NOTTTTTTTT Killo Volt Amp Hours HAVE TO ASK THEM THAT IM NOTTTTTTTTT SPECULATING ANY ANSWER HERE. (arent those things outside our house called Watt Hour meters instead of Volt Amp Hour meters???)

I see the way Janicholson and the buick man (he works in this field you know) approached the problem AS ACCURATE (considering the question given allllllll the unknowns such as power factor and any penalties and KWH rate etc)

Where I worked as an engineer we were charged for KWH use (amps x volts x time, it was not Killo Volt Amp Hours) but had an additional penalty if we were running a lousy power factor.

That whole Power factor thing is too complex to set out here in a few paragraphs what takes a book to fill and beyond what the poster asked in my opinion. Theres power and apparent power and Power Factor has to do with the degree of lag angle between the voltage and current. If the load is pure resisitve, current and voltage are in phase and if P = E x I x Cosine of the phase angle and the cosine of 0 = 1 THEN ITS A UNITY 1 POWER FACTOR (Volt x Amps = Watt)

HOWEVER a motor is an inductive load and some of the energy the utility provided goes to creating a magnetic field in the motor windings but you get no actual "work" out of it. The utility has to provide the amps x volts (watts) to make the motor turn (thats work). In the motor inductive load the current lags the voltage so theres a phase angle between the voltage and current legs and if P = E x I x Cosine of that phase angle THE POWER FACTOR IS NOTTTTTTTT GOING TO EQUAL ONE and the utility may or may not charge differently HAVE TO ASK THEM... Theres still the Voltage and Current BUTTTTTTTT the phase angle between them changes and thats what power factor is all about.....

Sooooooooo my answer would be similar to Buicks and Janicholsons Id ESTIMATE the volts x amp draw (thats ONLY an estimate, we dont know the load mind you) and estimate the running time and convert that to KWH and see what the KWH charge is and that would be my answer. Then if that wasnt good enough for the poster he can see if and how the utility deals with power factor AND IF theres any penalty and/or if they bill for KWH or KVAH etc BUT I BET BUICK AND JANICHOLSONS ANSWERS WOULD BE REASONABLY CLOSE

God Bless yall, this may help or may confuse lol power factor is beyond the posters question but KWH and the utilitys charge for a KWH he can likely comprehend and REGARDLESS I bet Buciks answer will be darn close.......

An early Merry Christmas

John T (Tooooo long retired and rusty EE to explain all this stuff as well as Buick could)

Replies:

Add a Reply Name: E-Mail: Subject: Comments: Optional Link URL: Link Title: Optional Image URL: Optional Video Title: Optional Video URL: Advanced Posting Options Email Notification: If you check this box, email will be sent to you whenever someone replies to this message. Your email address must be entered above to receive notification. This notification will be cancelled automatically after 2 weeks.   Advanced Posting Tools   Upload Photo  Select Gallery Photo  Attach Serial # List  Return to Post

TRACTOR PARTS	TRACTOR MANUALS

We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]