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Fordson Tractors Discussion Forum

You were EXTREMELY helpful!!

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MikeEmond

06-21-2007 13:02:23




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Thanks so much! While its a bummer not to have a hidden treasure, I was not told that it might be an original 1918 until after buying it. I was just happy not to have spent the $2300 asking price. The seller was nice enough though and I did get the radiator cap and coil box cover with it. As for the wheels, as weird as it may sound, it looks as though somebody had removed the lugs long ago and bolted thick canvas to the flat wheels as there are still some shreds of canvas visible. The seller did say there were also similar wheels on the front but that the original owner didn't want to part with them. So, who knows.

From what you have told me I think I can narrow it down to a 1920 through 1922. The tank did have the type stamped into it making it at oldest a 1920 and with the mushroom cap I'm thinking the newest it could be is a '22. Of coarse that's assuming all the older parts aren't off some other Fordson :) I plan on dismantling it and completely rebuilding it later on so I heard there is a casting date on the worm gear so until then I can be happy with narrowing it down this much. Thanks again, it would have taken me months to figure that all out on my own!
Mike

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stevewelker

06-24-2007 19:13:22




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 Re: You were EXTREMELY helpful!! in reply to MikeEmond, 06-21-2007 13:02:23  
Mike,
I looked over your pictures, and Butch Howe owned this tractor a few years ago, and I took pictures of it in 2001 or 2002 when he had it. I remember the front axel and smooth rear wheels. I think he sold it on Ebay a few years ago.
I would bet it is a 1920. The axle housings with fender grooves started in 1920, the dash with the choke rod to the outside(see groove and hole on right side of dash), no fender holes, and no patent dates was used up to 1921. 1922 dashes had patent dates and the choke rod went thru the dash, but no fender holes. Around June 1920 7 spoke rear wheels stared to be used. Also the mushroom oil filler cap and rainbow coil box point to 1922 or earlier. Also the radiator top tank you can see a faint oval around the fordson logo which lasted thru at least 1920 but was gone by 1922. A 1920 would have a 'Henry Ford and Son' gas tank with single filler hole. It could be a 1921, but there were very few tractors made in 1921, so odds say it is a 1920 made in June or later. The manifold/carb is from a newer Fordson, late 1924 thru early/mid 1926. The original Manifold carb setup would be a Holley model 234. Wheels without cleats where sold for golf coarse tractors by the same company that provided the wheels for Ford (Whitehead & Kales), along with 12" wide flat front wheels. Most golf coarse tractors also had 6" wide extension rims on the rears, look for holes in the rim lip between each spoke. Also that odd front axel may have had something to do with pulling gang mowers.
Look for casting dates, as most fordsons made in 1922 and earlier have alot of casting dates. Good places to look, engine side of dash, front axle support inside or outside, oil pan, rear axle housings around where they bolt to rear. around this time period, Most parts got put on the tractor in a week or two after being cast.
Hope this helps. Also you can contact Butch Howe, as he owned this tractor and may remember what year it was. Good luck on the restoration!
-Steve

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MikeEmond

06-25-2007 17:35:21




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 Re: You were EXTREMELY helpful!! in reply to stevewelker, 06-24-2007 19:13:22  
Ah! Thanks, all this info is awesome! I did see extra holes in the outer edge of the rear wheels and was wondering about that. The guy that sold it to me said that the previous owner had the flat front wheels but didn't want to sell them, so the seller put on the ones shown. I was also wondering about what the original maniforld set up was so this is great. You can bet I'll be out in the barn first chance I get to check out all those casting date locations :)

If you know who has those smooth front wheels and rear extensions I'd be interested in buying them in an effort to restore the tractor to its original purpose, otherwise, I'll probably just try to find lugs to bolt on the rear.

At this point the tractor is largely stripped down and I'm in the process of cleaning and rust removal. That might take a while.

Thanks again for all the info, its going into my tractor rebuild notebook for sure!

Mike

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Maine Fordson

06-26-2007 09:12:33




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 Re: Golf Course Fordson F's in reply to MikeEmond, 06-25-2007 17:35:21  
Mike --

You got a wealth of information from Steve. He and his family have 20 or so Fordson F's, and they've probably forgotten more about these tractors than most of us will ever know. They were at the big show in Penn's Cave, PA, last fall and did an exhibition wherein they disassembled and reassembled a Fordson over the course of a day (Butch Howe gave the running narrative). ...Anyway, they're good folks to have helping you out.

Funny how these tractors make the rounds...

Back to the subject at hand: I looked through all the references I have and didn't come up with anything on canvas-covered wheels. When Steve mentioned golf courses, though, it made sense. Once the lugs were removed from a standard wheel, a bit of canvas would help keep the wheels from spinning in wet grass. Probably a home-made remedy that was economical for the owner at the time.

Don Clough is a Fordson enthusiast here in Maine and has a large collection of F's. A couple of years ago he was asked to do a special golf course tractor restoration for a celebrity; follow the link below to see some photographs of his project.

He custom-made the front wheels. Using an old pair of standard fronts that had rusted through the rim (he separated the rim from the hub & spokes to use them), he had a local steel fabricator roll the rims into a cylinder out of 3/16 or 1/8 steel plate, then welded a flange along the edge. A bit time-consuming, but those golf-course wheels are not easy to find. There was a pair here on YT a few months back; I think the seller wanted $200 for them, and the ad ran for a month, which leads me to believe that they didn't sell. They might still be out there...

For the rears he removed the cleats from a standard wheel. He custom-made the extensions using two halves of a rear wheel, with a strip cut out from the middle and welded back together. Again, these wheels were rusted through in places -- please don't use perfectly good wheels to cut down!!! :-)

Hope you find the info & link useful, or at least informative!

-- Maine Fordson

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MikeEmond

06-26-2007 10:47:16




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 Re: Golf Course Fordson F's in reply to Maine Fordson, 06-26-2007 09:12:33  
Hi. Thanks for your help. I bet you're right about the home remedy canvas cover. I don't know if I'll try to replicate that as it seems to me it would be a perfect environment for rust to continue eating up the rears once the canvas got wet. I think the people in the link you provided have the right idea using cleats. I could probably have someone local fabricate new wheel extensions rather than cutting up an original wheel. The extensions in the photo seemed like a pretty simple part. I have a metal lathe so the cleats would be pretty simple as well I think. I'll look around for those fronts you were talking about though. As for Don Clough, I had seen his site a month or so back and spent a lot of time studying the pictures of the different years (and envying his collection, especially the tracksons).

Thanks so much for taking the time to look through your reference material for me. Everyone in this forum has been more helpful than I could have ever hoped for. And being my first tractor restoration I love getting all the help and advice I can get. Hopefully some day I can return the favor.

-Mike

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Maine Fordson

07-07-2007 10:35:34




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 Re: Lugs for Golf Course Wheels: Fordson F in reply to MikeEmond, 06-26-2007 10:47:16  
Mike --

I stopped by and visited with Don Clough this week, and asked him about the lugs on the golf course wheels he fabricated for Arnold Palmer's Fordson F.

You had mentioned that you have a metal lathe and could turn some if need be; as it turns out (pardon the pun) you don't need to...

According to Don, he used 1/2" stainless steel fine-thread bolts, one and one-half inches long, with self-locking nuts. He just drilled through the surface (or "tread") of the wheel (to see the pattern, look at the photos using the link in the posting above), poked the bolts through so that the nuts would be on the outer circumference, and torqued everything down.

That's it. Pretty simple, really, and just think of all the time you'll save (unless you like standing in front of the lathe, that is!)

Good luck with your project, and be sure to post some photos as you progress...

-- Maine Fordson

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MikeEmond

07-12-2007 14:42:01




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 Re: Lugs for Golf Course Wheels: Fordson F in reply to Maine Fordson, 07-07-2007 10:35:34  
Huh, that's great. When I looked at the photo the first time I just assumed they were tapered like the cleats found on golf shoes. Thinking back on it now I guess that wouldnt work as the end with the spike would get flattened or bent over the first time it came in contact with a rock. Nuts and bolts are a lot cheaper and easier. Thanks!
Mike



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