Posted by paul on January 31, 2016 at 17:13:25 from (66.44.132.180):
In Reply to: Re: How many acres posted by S2710 on January 31, 2016 at 16:39:53:
I like what you say, but reality gets in the way.
Established stuff has a real low, commodity like cost.
Big Oil has so many subsidies built into it. How do we sort that out?
If we want something new and different, it likely needs some sort of a kick start. New stuff has to build its infrastructure, and it needs to be built with today's EPA costly rules. Pipelines and seaports and oil wells and so forth that are grandfathered in from the 1960s and before can operate so much more cheaply than any new operation. They could not compete.
But some day the oil might run out. And then what do we do? We sit there on empty, and takes 20 years to get something new and different built up.......
What do we do for those 20 years?
But I certainly understand where you are coming from. I don't like the subsidies, and it appears a lot of the wind and solar panel stuff we have today needs the subsidy forever. And that isn't good.
Ethanol for example, has worked pretty good. It had its period of subsidies, but that ended several years ago, and now has to be pricd on the market without subsidy. I know the oil states have a very serious campaign against ethanol, and the misinformation continues from those companies, but if one looks at the big picture ethanol has been a big success, and is subsidy free now.
I'm concerned about the subsidies windmills especially have, and you have a good argument there.
The solar panels may improve and grow into self supporting, and might be able to wean themselves from subsidy. I hope so, and hope the technology works for us more and more.
I'm concerned about the land use of them, in what would be good ag land here in the upper Midwest. That is a different issue, but it is a serious concern I have with panels. Why not cover the urban roofs with them, instead of farmland? I know ther become issues on power grid available, but......
Then there is coal. We have so much coal available in this country, and we go and just turn our back on it. If it has a pollution issue, we need to work on that, not just abandon one of our more abundant power sources. It appears the political football is to just price coal higher and higher with EPA taxes and surcharges and such so as to make windmills and panels look closer to break even.
How would we deal with that in your 'no subsidies' world?
Politicians and special interest groups are resourceful, and would find ways around your 'no subsidies' rule.
So its a big complicated picture, and is sure understand where you are coming from.
For the foreseeable future we will want lots of transportation fuel which is mostly going to be liquid and contain a lot of btu per gallon. Multiple sources - oil wells, corn fields, beet fields, soybean fields, and nore.... Electric just isnt there yet. Batteries weigh too much, don't hold enough energy density. Telsa is neat, but won't do it all......
And we are going to want lots of electrical power, which seems to be coming from many sources - a good thing.
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